User talk:RobinHood70/Archive2010

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This is an archive of past User talk:RobinHood70 discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page, except for maintenance such as updating links.



Okay, this will take some explaining.... ;)

In short, there was drama. The drama wasn't doing my health any good, nor was it doing the site any good, and I knew I needed to step away from it. I also knew I wasn't ready to truly leave. So, I created an alternate identity, finished the project I'd been working on, and did a clean start. I informed the active administrators of what I was doing and, later, one or two other users as well. With my retirement, the drama I was involved with died off overnight, quite literally.

Initially, I had intended to stick strictly to grammatical editing of pages I'd never really touched before, including playing and therefore editing Arena pages. I knew my grammatical fixes would probably stick out like a sore thumb, though, possibly re-igniting the drama, so I changed what I had intended to do. It was as much of a surprise to me as it will be to anybody else that with the absence of drama, I had all this mental energy all of a sudden and was ready to take on a new project. I really hadn't realized just how much it had been affecting me. As it turned out, for several different reasons, I got drawn towards template editing and ultimately decided to pursue that...pretty much to the exclusion of all else. :)

However, since days like today (over 100 edits in about 3 hours) are likely to happen intermittently, and I don't feel it's fair to dump that on the active Patrollers who have enough other edits to deal with, I've decided to finish the project with the account where edits will be auto-patrolled and not bother anyone. Of course, since I also believe in cleaning up my own messes, I now have a large number of Joram's edits to patrol. Oh joy! For the time being, I probably won't be taking on any other Patroller duties other than occasionally patrolling edits related to whatever I'm working on. Once the template revamping is done, I'll resume normal duties if I feel up to it again at that time. —Robin Hood (TalkE-mailContribs) 08:10, 2 March 2010 (UTC)

No offence but I kinda had a bit of a suspicion that you and Joram were the same person, I started suspecting this when I noticed that your signatures were the same. No offence intended. --ModderElGrande 21:25, 4 March 2010 (UTC)
My signature only changed to be the same after I resumed editing from this account. If you look above, you'll see my previous signature; I changed to Joram's signature right after that message as I recall. Robin HoodTalk 21:28, 4 March 2010 (UTC)


You seem to have some floaters off to the side because of your new quote, extending the page making it have a scrollbar at the bottom. Just thought I would let you know.--Corevette789 00:12, 5 March 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, I'll look into it. So far I'm unable to reproduce it, but I haven't tested extensively. What browser and OS are you using? Robin HoodTalk 01:20, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
Firefox and Windows XP Media Center edition, yup confirmed they are still like that.--Corevette789 01:30, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
That most recent change fixed it.--Corevette789 01:57, 5 March 2010 (UTC)
That's odd...what I was doing was unrelated and should have had no effect on the page. Let me know if it pops back up again at any point. Robin HoodTalk 01:59, 5 March 2010 (UTC)


I was wondering if you could contact me (preferably on IRC) to help me with some changes I wanted to make to me signature to fit the rest of my "theme" I seem to have going on.--Corevette789 00:23, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

Done. Robin HoodTalk 00:28, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
Thanks!--Corevette789 00:50, 8 March 2010 (UTC) (looks nice eh?)
It does indeed. I was hoping to find a more elegant method, but it looks like what I was after (an inline table or something similar) doesn't work. Oh well.... My CSS knowledge is okay, but not great. It's possible that Nx may know the more elegant method that I can't seem to find. Robin HoodTalk 01:11, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
Yes as it seems I took something from him too but I am not accused of being him ;)--Corevette789 01:58, 8 March 2010 (UTC)


Choco chip cookie.png
You have been given a cookie!

Your dedication and diligence to the wiki has not gone unnoticed. A user has seen the progress you've made, and has given you a cookie because of it. Good work! The user had the following to say:

The past couple of days on IRC you have helped me several times and have just been all-around friendly.Thanks for all the help you have given me and having a good attitude about it seeing as I ask some complicated questions :)--Corevette789 01:02, 8 March 2010 (UTC)
Thank you! Robin HoodTalk 02:12, 8 March 2010 (UTC)

thanks a heaps ^_^[edit]

thanks for the answer on my page, ill start using forums, i dont know how yet but ill figure it out ^_^ Mor'tar'iit 01:52, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

Glad I could help. If you haven't found it yet, the UESP Forums can be accessed by clicking on "Forums" in the "Community" section at the left of your browser window. Robin HoodTalk 02:21, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

A small NPC problem...[edit]

Hey RH! I have another case of “weird NPC behavior” – and I figured I would bother you with the problem. When you trigger the Caught in the Hunt-quest, Kurdan gro-Dragol shows up at the Lonely Suitor Lodge, with a very simple schedule. But one thing bothers me – between midnight and 6am he acts weird. He freezes up on the second floor, in the same spot and in the same position, and occasionally “tries” to wander away from the spot, only to return to his freeze seconds later. While the time indicates that he is supposed to be sleeping, I can’t figure out what is causing this. Maybe you can? Thanks in advance! --Krusty 07:41, 10 March 2010 (UTC)

I'll have a look at it tomorrow. If you see me in chat, bug me if I don't mention working on it. ;) Robin HoodTalk 09:07, 10 March 2010 (UTC)
Okay, I think we already covered all the "reportable" info in IRC, but just so it's all here: Kurdan can't get to bed because he doesn't own the nearby bed and the room and beds upstairs are both owned by Abhuki from the Faregyl Inn of all people. My initial fix was to just remove ownership of the door and beds upstairs, but then the PC has free access to the rooms, as I had figured they would. Not that it really matters in terms of documenting it on the wiki, but my current fix, which I still need to test, is to give ownership of the door to Kurdan so that he can go through it, and he owns the bed on the far side of the room as well. Then Bogrum owns the other bed until it gets rented. Once rented, everything works like it would in any other inn: the door is unlocked (regardless of the owner) and the bed is de-owned, allowing the player access.
In a similar vein, as I had also mentioned, I noticed that Adamus Phillida owns the door to the rentable room in Faregyl. In that case, however, it makes no difference at all since, like my fix above, the door will be unlocked regardless of the owner. Nevertheless, I corrected it, just to be on the safe side. Robin HoodTalk 00:31, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
Wow, lots of weirdness discovered! Anyway, thanks for the thorough testing - I was pretty sure the problem was a bit smaller, but at least we know what is going on with Kurdan at night. I'll try to write a schedule and the relevant bug note, based on your investigation. Good work! --Krusty 06:53, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, apparently there's a little more weirdness in that you get several people possibly trying to share the same a room that two out of three of them can't open the door to (the small room next to where Bogrum is). I'll have to double-check that tomorrow because I wasn't that thorough — I was in a "play" mood tonight, not a "program" mood. As it turned out, my idea to fix the problem was more of a hassle than it was worth, so I think he's gonna end up getting a Wander package instead of a Sleep package. It's not like he's going to be around for very long anyway usually. Robin HoodTalk 06:59, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
Question is: After you are done investigating, could you do the bug note (when I have written the schedule later today), because you are bound to know 120% more about it than me, and if I wrote the note it would probably need to be rewritten anyway. If not, then I'll just give it a shot based on the above facts. --Krusty 10:40, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
Page is up! --Krusty 16:34, 11 March 2010 (UTC)
Okay, I'll have a look at it in a few minutes when I'm done catching up on my watchlist and so forth. Robin HoodTalk 22:52, 11 March 2010 (UTC)

Other Possible Projects[edit]

I saw this edit a couple of days ago and I have another possible project for you should you be interested...

This one has been at the back of my mind for, quite literally, over a year. I just edited Morrowind:Dissident Priests and was struck by how large the footer template is. Wikipedia tends to wrap footer templates in a ShowHide but it's something we skipped for some reason. I recall looking very briefly at the templates and finding it couldn't be done trivially. What we need is a template guru who's looking for a task to take a proper look.

Whether or not you choose to accept this task, your talk page will explode in 10 seconds. rpeh •TCE 01:24, 12 March 2010 (UTC)

Since it's template-related, I'll copy it to the Round 2 section and have a look at it when I get there. Thanks for letting me know about it...especially during Round 1, my intent is not to really change anything significantly unless it badly needs it. Round 2, I'll be looking at things like that a little more, and possibly making a lot more CP posts as a result. ;) Robin HoodTalk 02:13, 12 March 2010 (UTC)

Security Question[edit]

I was wondering if I used a program (eg. TOR) for security purposes, if the site would try and block me? (I'll be on IRC)--Corevette789 22:33, 13 March 2010 (UTC)

You'd be better off asking one of the admins, but as far as I know, if you have an account, you're's only anonymous edits that it blocks...I think. (I won't be on IRC for a bit, just popped upstairs to check something.) Robin HoodTalk 23:58, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
Thanks, I asked Rpeh on IRC and he said most of the nodes would not be allowed.--Corevette789 23:59, 13 March 2010 (UTC)
Actually, I'm not sure how it'll work. If they're already blocked you might have a problem but then again you might not. Certainly you won't have a problem editing with a named account from an unblocked node. The problem may come if somebody decides to use TOR to attack the site again - you might find yourself associated with the vandal. Believe me, when that happens it's not a pleasant experience. rpeh •TCE 00:08, 14 March 2010 (UTC)
As I've seen. I think I will just get something else that is a "safer" investment for me--Corevette789 00:11, 14 March 2010 (UTC)

More Questions...[edit]

I was thinking how I could make the RC changes page a Live Feed. I tried to find facebook's code and I turned up nothing. I just downloaded greasemonkey and was thinking if I made this publicly available, or DaveH even added it to the site, it would make things easier for some people. I was thinking if I could get feedback on weather or not this would even work, then maybe I could start.--Corevette789 23:32, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

I'm not familiar with Greasemonkey, but I'd suggest bringing it up on the Community Portal (with a link, or nobody'll ever check it out, trust me :Þ). Robin HoodTalk 23:34, 15 March 2010 (UTC)

Javascript security concerns[edit]

The subpages in UESPWiki:Javascript should be protected, at least at the patroller level, since you can do nasty stuff using javascript. -- Nx / talk 10:41, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

Good point, thanks for the tip. Would that be enough, though? I'm thinking that if you tried hard, you could probably fool the wiki software into thinking a new section had been added, then adding Javascript to that. Not sure it would work; I don't think I've ever used section protection, much less tried to figure out how to violate it! Considering that they're not likely to need changing very often, we may want to go for Full Protection. I'm on my way out right now, but I'll bug GK about it later. :) Robin HoodTalk 18:21, 16 March 2010 (UTC)

Journal Entries[edit]

I don't believe consensus was made in order for you to change the {{Journal Entries}} template. 'Update to improve support for embedded header rows.' Why did you do this without consensus? I want to know pretty badly, especially since I have half a mind to revert every single edit. Elliottalk 09:18, 30 March 2010 (UTC)

Rpeh and I agreed, you disagreed because you felt it was difficult to understand and use. I improved the usability and with the lack of further discussion and a majority in favour, I went ahead and implemented it. If you'd like to revert them all, that's your right, but I rather suspect it would be seen as malicious and earn you disciplinary action. That's not up to me, though. Robin HoodTalk 09:21, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
2-1 is not consensus, especially when the main opposition is by the person who structured and implemented it. I find this extremely disrespectful and insulting. Perhaps you should get 'disciplinary action'. Elliottalk 09:45, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
Please stop making threats Elliot. As for the endorsement for the edits, they look OK to me, as they concern a code update; the actual content hasn't changed. I prefer how CSS is no longer a must to glue two tables together that never need to be apart anyway. --Timenn-<talk> 11:57, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
Threats? Elliottalk 14:39, 30 March 2010 (UTC)
So saying "Perhaps you should get 'disciplinary action'" isn't making a threat ? What is it then ? (Sorry if my jumping in was unwelcome)--TheAlbinoOrc 00:39, 1 April 2010 (UTC)


Thanks ^_^ i know it took ages to respond, but i forgot about it, lol-ness, if you have the time to tell me how to make a forum, that would be great ^_^ but if you cant be bothered, dont worry about itMor'tar'iit 23:12, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Actually, that's my fault for not responding on your talk page...I thought I had, but maybe I forgot to hit save or something. Anyway, to find the forums, just look at the menu on the left of your screen. Under "community", click on "Forums" and that will take you to the UESP forums where you can sign up and post your message. Note that other than being run by the same person, the forums are almost completely independent of the wiki, so you will have to sign up for an account there and everything. Robin HoodTalk 23:22, 4 April 2010 (UTC)
^_^ thanks a bunch, i read your page, sorry bout your chronic fatigue :( at least you have your computer games:)
if your still keen on helping out, could you explain to me what a 'shader' is, if you know.Mor'tar'iit 23:38, 4 April 2010 (UTC)
Not very well, to be honest...I only know a very small amount about modern graphics technology. As I understand it, though, the basic concept of a shader is something that decides how much light will appear on a surface. For example, if you're in a dungeon and there's a lit torch on a nearby wall, the shader is what figures out where the light is shining and how brightly. Robin HoodTalk 23:42, 4 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks again ^_^ your awesome, lol-nessMor'tar'iit 23:50, 4 April 2010 (UTC)


You have been given a plateful of cookies!

Great job with the Glitches/Proposed page! Given the amazing amount of work you've done, a single cookie isn't enough ;) Thanks again for the great time and energy you are devoting to a task that I know is not exactly of the most exciting :P --SerCenKing Talk 08:54, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the cookies! Mmmm...cookies.... Robin HoodTalk 23:08, 18 April 2010 (UTC)

Now hush  :P[edit]


I still refuse to sign my posts though, outside of this special occasion. If the wiki wants every single person to type the same thing at the end of every single Talk edit, it should be doing it automatically. Aliana 03:42, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

Hehehe...well, I should warn you then, this will earn you a great many posts on your talk page, most especially from us Patrollers. ;) I tend to agree that it should add the four tildes by default, though that gets distracting in its own right. To have it sign after-the-fact would be really annoying in the cases where that's not what you want to do. (Not to mention the rare occasions where ~~~ or ~~~~~ are preferred for whatever reason.)
And I'd say "Welcome to the wiki", but I guess that doesn't really apply here. Ummm...welcome to having a name? ;) Robin HoodTalk 04:58, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
Aliana, You do realize that there's a button up at the top of the page that auto-signs right ? You don't actually have to type everything in.--TheAlbinoOrc 18:33, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
Thanks, though it takes me as long to mouse to that as it does to just type it. I still object to manual signing on principle, but it's as unfair for me to make more work for the "responsible" (obsessive? :P) people who go around adding "unsigned" tags to everything as it is annoying for the wiki to make more work for me, but the wiki doesn't feel guilty about it, so... --Aliana 09:07, 21 April 2010 (UTC)
Speaking as one of the aforementioned people, I believe "obsessive" is the correct term, yes. :) Robin HoodTalk 10:05, 21 April 2010 (UTC)

Join the Fun?[edit]

Hey RH! Me and SerCenKing have thrown ourselves head first into investigating/writing one of the buggiest NPCs in Oblivion, namely Fathis Ules. Since the task list is long and includes cell checking and bugs weirder than weird - and because I know you like investigations like this - maybe you could take a look at our discussion here? It starts out with a bit of rambling, but gets serious pretty quick. I hope you will join the fun - you will notice that I have already mentioned your name somewhere along the line. Oh, and this is what SerCenKing have written so far - wisely put in a Sandbox. Hope to see you there! --Krusty 21:29, 19 April 2010 (UTC)

I may not be able to check it out today, I've got a fair bit to do, but I'll definitely try to have a look later tonight or tomorrow. Robin HoodTalk 21:44, 19 April 2010 (UTC)
Brilliant! No rush or anything -there is definitely some very interesting things wrong with Fathis Ules. And if you know anything about that "Fathis Fix"-thing (the fact that it even exist makes it interesting), please let us know - when you have the time, of course. :) --Krusty 21:56, 19 April 2010 (UTC)


OB-creature-Charlotte.jpg OB-creature-Hjalti.jpg OB-creature-Wolf.jpg

Hi, Seeing the three pictures I provided (Charlotte, Hjalti, Wolf,) are you sure Hjalti is a Dog? Becasue he looks like a wolf.

Don't blame me, that's what the Construction Set says in multiple places, though it is confusing, since there's overlap: the ID is "DogBattlehorn", the NIF file is "Creatures\Dog\Skeleton.NIF", the combat style is "DefaultDog", and he's got a spell called "LL0DiseaseDog10" (Witbane) and his sounds are all dog-related. His model files are wolf, though, which isn't normal for other dogs. For normal wolves, they all have the wolf disease, wolf combat styles, etc. Looking at other dogs, they too tend to use a few wolf parts here and there, but not the wolf model like Hjalti does. Maybe he's a husky or other close-to-wolf breed? :) It's possible they meant for him to be a pet wolf, but then I would've expected him to at least have the wolf disease (Helljoint) instead of the dog one. Ask rpeh for his opinion when he's double-checking the info — maybe there's some other indicator I'm not aware of. Robin HoodTalk 00:04, 25 April 2010 (UTC)
I'm on the fence ;)
We list Hjalti amongst the wolves here, but describe him as a crossbreed there so I did the same in the new page. rpeh •TCE 07:24, 25 April 2010 (UTC)

Wrath of Sithis Edit[edit]

Hey there. I posted about an untested possible glitch, in which if you run away far enough from the Wrath of Sithis, it says you have 'defeated' it. When this happened to me, I was up in the mountains near Bruma, and I'm pretty certain there were no people or creatures. Maybe someone should test this in different areas (populated and unpopulated)? --Darksoulknight 15:52, 26 April 2010 (UTC)

I'll do some more testing, but the only times I was able to get that message were when the Wrath got into combat with something. The one time I didn't get the message, I'd hidden and outrun it by maxing my stats out with the console, so it had given up the chase in an unpopulated area and just sat there. I then ran for a good 3 or 4 minutes in roughly a straight line away from it (give or take terrain) without getting the message. That said, I only ran the test a few times, so more testing wouldn't hurt.
Having said that, the main article page isn't the place to put possible glitches. For that sort of thing, the talk page is better, until others can confirm or refute your findings. Doing it that way, everybody has the chance to contribute before putting it on the main page. By putting it on the article page, you're more likely just to get reverted if the Patroller is unable to duplicate it. Sometimes we'll move it to the talk page ourselves if we want another opinion, which I'll do now that you've confirmed that my speculation as to why it happened is an unlikely explanation. Robin HoodTalk 18:46, 26 April 2010 (UTC)


Hey RH! As you might have noticed, I copy/pasted the Fathis Ules-relevant bugs from the Sins of the Father quest page, so we can get it all on one page. When the time comes, I think we should link to Fathis' own page from the quest-page. But: Now I am unsure about the last 4 bugs in my Sandbox (I know I noted that the last three needed merging, but hey...) - because I really don't know exactly what the UOP does - and when. So I was wondering; Could you, provided you have some time and the kidneys are feeling better, sort the notes and maybe merge some of them, adding the relevant UOP-tags when necessary? We're almost finished doing the buggiest character in the game.... :) --Krusty 07:36, 29 April 2010 (UTC)

Notice Alignment[edit]

How do I align the second notice on my page, so that it's at the left ? Also is there a way to make links show up as a different color than purple-ish if you've clicked it ?--TheAlbinoOrc 17:40, 30 April 2010 (UTC)

Until now, you couldn't unless you redid the table on your own. I've just added a margin parameter to the template that'll give you at least a primitive method of changing it. Try adding margin=0 auto 1em 0 to the current template and that should do it. Robin HoodTalk 02:46, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
Thanks !!!--TheAlbinoOrc 03:16, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
Oh, I missed the second half of that question. I'm pretty sure there's a few ways, but normally, you'd just do it in your browser preferences. I'm not familiar with CSS ways, though I think it can be done that way as well...rpeh or Nx might know. Robin HoodTalk 04:34, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
I, think I was unclear actually, I wanted to know if there was a parameter like say, linkcolor= that could be put in the template so I don't have to change the background color of the notice because the link is invisible.--TheAlbinoOrc 20:31, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

The easiest way would be with font color tags inside the link making the link an entirely different color, like this:

Hi, welcome to my userpage ! If you have a question please leave a message on my talk page.

Note that the tags have to be inside the link, surrounding the "display" text, or it seems to break the template. --GKtalk2me 23:14, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

Thanks !!!!--TheAlbinoOrc 23:39, 2 May 2010 (UTC)

Two Scores Ago... You were born...[edit]

Happy Birthday! (Yeah, I am a few hours early :P) Elliot (talk) 01:29, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

You're not early in UTC. ;) Thanks! Robin HoodTalk 02:26, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
Happy birthday! Here's hoping you have a great day. rpeh •TCE 10:29, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
Happy Birthday! Kalrot 15:21, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
Thank you everyone! Robin HoodTalk 16:39, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
Happy birthday RobinHood70! Talk Wolok gro-Barok Contributions 18:13, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

Happy birthday from me too!--Corevette789 21:03, 1 May 2010 (UTC)

A very happy birthday from me as well! --Krusty 21:06, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
Happy birthday Robin! (Or do you go by Hood??)--Arch-Mage MattTalk 21:28, 1 May 2010 (UTC)
Happy birthday RH! Hope you had a great day. --GKtalk2me 04:27, 2 May 2010 (UTC)
Wasn't the quote "2 score and 6 years ago..." ha ha I'm not one for history, but lincoln said that in a speach right? Someone that said something about racisim O,o IDK I slept through history. Mikeyboy52 18:04, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
You're on the right track. It was Abraham Lincoln, but it was "four score and seven", not "two score and six". :) Robin HoodTalk 18:08, 25 May 2010 (UTC)
Oh yeah, 2 score and 6 years ago was something else, not really history though. Mikeyboy52 14:46, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

() Okay, now you've got me curious.... :) Robin HoodTalk 18:38, 27 May 2010 (UTC)


() So, I decided to bring the frequently used WP template over here; however, I only used the shorter one since I had coding issues with the lengthier one. I decided I should inform you, since I know you are doing a bunch of templates as of late. Elliot (talk) 21:09, 3 May 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, though in reality, I appreciate it more from the user's perspective than the designer's perspective — I'll probably start using it frequently. I couldn't decide if I liked or hated the longer one; the coding was interesting though. What was the coding issue with the longer one? Robin HoodTalk 08:00, 4 May 2010 (UTC)
If the only issue with the longer one is the character encoding, try just replacing padleft with #pad instead. (Takes the same parameters in the same order, so a straight replace is sufficient.) That said, I'd still prefer the one you've got there now instead of the longer one. Robin HoodTalk 09:02, 4 May 2010 (UTC)

RE: Abusive E-mail by Elliot[edit]

Alright. --Michaeldsuarez (Talk) (Deeds) 11:06, 8 May 2010 (UTC)

word user boxs?[edit]

hi!i was just wondering how you make userboxs that have words instead of a picture?--GUM!!! 00:55, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Just use a custom userbox, and instead of using an image in the id parameter, you use text. Here's an example from my user page, but without most of the formatting.
{{Userbox|id=aka|info=This user was also known as [[User:Joram|Joram]].}}
...which would give you this:
aka This user was also known as Joram.
Robin HoodTalk 01:10, 21 May 2010 (UTC)
ok thanks!--GUM!!! 01:15, 21 May 2010 (UTC)


Thanks for the tweaks on the Protection Template, I hoped I wasn't going to majorly screw up something ;) --SerCenKing Talk 18:38, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Hahaha...considering that it was me that screwed it up in the first place, I don't think you had anything to worry about. Thanks for the catch...though I'd imagine it was hard to miss. :) Robin HoodTalk 18:41, 21 May 2010 (UTC)

Fanfiction, Characters etc. - Part of the Wiki or Not ?[edit]

Just wondering about this because of Rpeh saying this (I quote here) "I need to remind you that the UESP wiki is not a forum. There is a separate [1] forum if you want to chat with other people about fanfics, characters and other things not related to the wiki. I know you are helping the wiki in other ways, and that is very much appreciated, but there's a place for non-wiki chat and this isn't it.

At the moment, you (and others) are clogging up the recent changes page with irrelevant edits that still require checking and patrolling." to goblin lair so are these wiki-related or not ? My opinion would be that they are - but obviously not everyone feels that way, so is there an official policy or not ?--TheAlbinoOrc 02:56, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

It's a difficult subject with a lot of different points of view. Some people feel that fan fiction should be removed entirely, others support it completely, and there's a whole range of opinions in between. I'm not sure if we have a policy on it, or where it is if we do, but I think the general consensus is that if you're writing the fan fiction itself, there's no problem. When it comes down to the point that you and other users are essentially carrying on a private conversation about content that will remain strictly in your user space (as fan fiction does), that's where it becomes a judgement call. Short conversations are fine—at some point or another, we've all written things that aren't, strictly speaking, geared towards helping the wiki—but when it becomes a longer conversation about User-space content between only a couple of users, it might be best to consider moving it to IRC, a forum, or private e-mails. Robin HoodTalk 03:55, 25 May 2010 (UTC)

Question About Tables[edit]

Sorry to ask you so many questions, but you seem to be the only fully active person on here that can answer them so here's my question: Is there some way to compare table entries to find redundant ones, and then automatically sort them alphabetically/by numeric value ?--TheAlbinoOrc 22:50, 27 May 2010 (UTC)

I dont' mind answering specific questions — I don't advertise myself as a mentor because I found it led to too many "I'm new...mentor me" type requests, with no agenda or details of what they already knew or wanted to know, and I don't deal well with generalities. :-/
As to your question, there's no way to find redundant rows in a table from within the wiki. The best you could do for that would be to cut & paste it into a database or spreadsheet and do comparisons there, neither of which is terribly easy, so you'd probably only want to do it on tables with more than about 100 rows or so. You can sort alphabetically (at least when viewed) simply by adding "sortable" to the class="wikitable" portion of a table, so you'd get class="wikitable sortable" or just class="sortable" if there was no class after the {| yet. I'm pretty sure that only sorts alphabetically, though, which means numbers would sort as 1, 10, 11, 2, 200, 22, etc. You might wanna double-check on that if it's a major concern. Even if it does, that can still make it a lot easier to identify duplicate rows. There are limitations even there, though, in that you can't specify a default sort...the only way to do that is to manually edit the table and move each line to where you want it (or, again, copy & paste the table code to something else, sort there, then copy it back...but that's got its own set of issues). Robin HoodTalk 00:10, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

My Condolences[edit]

I'm sorry your hot water heater broke. Have a fire OB-icon-Fire.png !--TheAlbinoOrc 00:58, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

same heer!( hey orc i don't know if he can cast spells;) )--GUM!!! 01:03, 28 May 2010 (UTC)
ROFL! Thanks, guys! Robin HoodTalk 02:19, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

Your welcome !--TheAlbinoOrc 18:39, 28 May 2010 (UTC)

summoned creatures[edit]

in relatiion to the question in the oblivion talk:soul trap section on 26 may, thanx and apologies for not looking before I wrote. I am finding this site a great info source for anything im having trouble with in oblivion. thanx again.

also was that the appropriate area to ask that question?— Unsigned comment by Elvenator (talkcontribs) on 30 May 2010

Yes, it was ok to put it there (and it should remain there for the future) --Arch-Mage MattTalk 02:35, 30 May 2010 (UTC)
What he said. :) If it's a fairly generic question that many people are likely to want to know the answer to, then the question is appropriate on the talk page of whatever it applies to. If it's something more specific to your particular game, then the Forums (see the links on the left) are more appropriate. Also, don't worry too much about not looking before you wrote - even if you had, on some of these pages, the information is easy to miss. I just pointed you to it because it's shorter than cutting & pasting the whole text and it tells anybody who might think it needs to be added to the page that it's already there. Robin HoodTalk 02:44, 30 May 2010 (UTC)

Magicka Bug[edit]

I suppose you've already answered the question, but I had mentioned the Magicka bug on the talk page. I'd normally have no hesitation in removing something like that, but since this is about achieving a maximum I thought it might be worth a note further down the page. rpeh •TCE 18:10, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

Hadn't noticed your post about it. I could see it as a note below the non-bug version, but I'm fine with whatever you choose there. Robin HoodTalk 18:17, 31 May 2010 (UTC)
Meh. I'm fine with it not being mentioned, but we'll see if somebody replies or adds it back. rpeh •TCE 18:31, 31 May 2010 (UTC)

Good luck[edit]

Good luck with the operation. Just don't look up how the used to perform this kind of thing back in the 17th/18th centuries... rpeh •TCE 06:14, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

Good luck with the operation, RH! --Krusty 08:05, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

Good luck !--TheAlbinoOrc 14:15, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

same here! luck good!;)--GUM!!! 14:56, 1 June 2010 (UTC)
Thanks everyone! Just got the call and they want me there in just under 6 hours, so I'll be prepping for that and then heading out of here. Will post back to this thread and/or change my notice templates with updates when I'm recovered enough to do so. Robin HoodTalk 17:12, 1 June 2010 (UTC)

If you are up for it...[edit]

Hey RH! Good to have you back - sorry to hear that you had to go through some painful times, but hopefully you are recovering now. We have another problem! So, if you are up to it, maybe you can solve this weird bug? Both me and rpeh have spent too much time on this mystery today (and you get kindda tired after testing it for too long) and I would be really glad to hear your opinion. Problem is here. All the best! --Krusty 18:54, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Well, I was doing okay, but then I started to get kidney pain, so I had to abort fairly quickly. Seems to have passed now, but now I'm stoned on pain meds for no good reason, so I think I should probably wait...I might end up having Algot marry Narina and father Uriel Septim at this point and see no problem with this logic at all. ;) Okay, so I'm not quite that bad, but this is definitely not the time for further testing. I think I got it in the explanation I left on the page, but I'll do some more testing later tonight or tomorrow if I'm up to it and see if I can verify that a little bit more thoroughly. Robin HoodTalk 21:02, 4 June 2010 (UTC)

Question, hope noone minds[edit]

I didn't want to ask on rpeh or elliots page, because it might encourage things, but is the conflict still (t)here? Mikeyboy52 06:59, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

Nvm i found out. Mikeyboy52 07:13, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
Glad I could help. :) Robin HoodTalk 13:06, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
I can see parts of the conflict, but even when i dig through the history, its hard to find out what made them snap. Still looking though, some of the points are intressting. Mikeyboy52 15:38, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
The breaking point was a long time ago, then tension came, now fighting is going on all the time. There is a LOT to this, involving other editors also.--Corevette789 15:44, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

I've seen a few other editors who were involved, but nothing more than trying to find a solution to the problem. Overall at least. Mikeyboy52 15:56, 6 June 2010 (UTC)

You're probably on your own to figure it out here, no offence. I think if anybody tries to summarize or points to a specific incident or whatever, someone else will disagree and it risks opening up yet another debate. Also keep in mind that some discussion has been via IRC and private chats/e-mails, so even if you read every relevant contribution there is on the wiki, you may still not get the full picture. Robin HoodTalk 16:13, 6 June 2010 (UTC)
No offense taken, I understand ;D I've gotten a pretty good picture and I can see why that would be the case. Although, it would be nice if IRC wasn't real-time. I don't know why, but a lot of "conflicts" (however short they may be) seem to be great "stories" in a sense. Mikeyboy52 16:28, 6 June 2010 (UTC)


This is a comment towards your "hate" of mmo(rpgs). The point isn't always to interact with them, in real life, I don't think you could get away with pking (player killing). I also don't think it possible to make yourself invulnerable for 2 minuets by sacrificing your summoned creature. Lol. The only problem I have with them are how addicting they get :P Mikeyboy52 09:18, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Sry if im interupting but mmo's and rpg's are not the same thing
MMO: Massive Multiplayer Online
RPG: Role Playing game
there is a huge difference between mmo's and rpg's Arny 10:04, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
By "MMO(RPG's)", he meant MMORPG. He wasn't saying that they're the same. Personally, I dislike MMO's, since they're basically Web 2.0 (social networking) combined with computer games. --Michaeldsuarez (Talk) (Deeds) 14:29, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
Hey Mikeyboy (et al <g>). This is actually one of the questions I get fairly frequently, and I've yet to find a good answer for it. I just plain don't like MMOs, whether they're RPGs or something else (though I'm hard-pressed to think of an MMO that isn't an RPG). Even if the point isn't to interact with people, they're still there! Some will approach and want to chat, some will avoid you; some will be nice, some will be dicks; but all of them are unpredictable, unscripted and unrelaxing for me. Plus, there's no expectation when I play that I'll play at a certain date or time or that I'll play a certain way or fill a certain role.
This is pure speculation, but it's known that I have a mild case of Asperger's. That means that for me, social interaction is more challenging than it is for others. Maybe the reason I like RPGs where there's no one but me and the game is that the social interaction is very limited and follows a fairly fixed set of rules. But then again, asking me why I don't like MMOs is kinda like asking me why I'm gay...there could be a million factors, but in the end, for me, that's just the way it is. I don't begrudge anybody else their MMOs, though...well, other than the fact that I think they're probably a whole new type of addiction. :) Robin HoodTalk 16:01, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

To each his own I suppose, but should TESMMO come out, do you think you would try it, or pass? — Unsigned comment by Mikeyboy52 (talkcontribs) at 16:18 on 8 June 2010

I'd watch YouTube videos of it or promo videos, just to see what it was like, but otherwise I'd pass, no question about it. Robin HoodTalk 16:25, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
The promo videos are usually what hook me. Mostly because I love awesome graphics. The first time I saw an oblivion gate it took me about 5 minuets to remember I was playing a game. Mikeyboy52 17:03, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
Dont know about you guys but I dislike them, I find them like internet games and I dont like internet games and if a tes mmorpg came out I dont think it deserves the title tes --Arny 19:08, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

warning question[edit]

hoodedmage made 4 "nonsense" posts, I was wondering if it would be acceptable for me to put a warning on his page. Mikeyboy52 17:36, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

No, a warning would be inappropriate. All of the editor's editor were made in good faith; he/she just isn't familiar with the standards we use to determine what is relevant on articles. The type of nonsense that may deserve a warning is true nonsense -- edits that make no sense, or have absolutely nothing to do with the article. In other words, if it's clear even to the person making the edit that the content doesn't belong on the article. --NepheleTalk 18:18, 8 June 2010 (UTC)
Thinking about it, I can see how "Mer is french for sea" (or something like that) might make sense. Since he was doing it on all the elf pages. Mikeyboy52 07:42, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

Scripting Problems[edit]

Can you take a look at my question here since A. No one answered in the past few days B. the last activity on this page was in 2007 meaning (at least to me) that it isn't frequented and C. You seem like someone fairly familiar with scripts.--TheAlbinoOrc 22:55, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

I tried, but I'm not sure how much help I can be. I've done a small amount of Oblivion scripting and no Morrowind scripting at all. Robin HoodTalk 23:41, 9 June 2010 (UTC)
They were indeed case sensitive thank you for the help! I'm having other problems but they come from a lack of scripting knowledge on my part.--TheAlbinoOrc 16:50, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

Quick CS Question[edit]

Hi, I just wanted to ask what was the base time in the CS under AI? It just displays as 0. I guessed it was midnight, which resulted in a person i created sleeping in the afternoon.--Arch-Mage MattTalk 01:55, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

I'm not sure if I'm understanding your question correctly, but if I am, it's a standard 24-hour clock, with 0 = midnight and counting up from there. Robin HoodTalk 02:44, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
Oh, I guess I did something else wrong. I'm still learning with AI.


Do you know how to display an image (located on uesp) and have it link to another page, such as my userpage? Mikeyboy52 14:30, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

Yes, I do. (I was tempted to leave it at that, but that would be mean. <g>) Try something like this: [[File:SomeFile.png|link=page]]. Here's an example: If we're still running 1.14, you won't see this text.. There are still some things you can't do, however, such as putting custom hover text on an image that links somewhere (it'll always be the link name) because we're still using MediaWiki 1.14. If you look at the code of this message, you can see on that icon that there should be custom text, but it doesn't display. MediaWiki 1.16 fixes this as far as I know. If you're thinking of an image for your signature, I think we allow that, but I'm not sure. Certainly if you make it something obnoxious, though, people will come beat on you mercilessly until you change it. :) Robin HoodTalk 15:57, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
Thats exactly what im doing, almost finished, just cant figure out how to switch the "signature" part of it. Is it the prefrences thing? if it is, i currently have a template as the signature... is that how you do it? {{subst:User:Mikeyboy52:Signature1}} 16:10, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
fail... now i cant find out how to do it... Mikeyboy5216:11, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
(Edit conflict) I'm also pretty sure we allow images in signatures see Lukish's signature--TheAlbinoOrc 16:13, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict) In your preferences, you would use {{subst:User:Mikeyboy52/Signature1}} and then make sure "Raw signatures" is checked. After that, it's just a matter of signing with the standard ~~~~. Robin HoodTalk 16:16, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
WP:Signatures is UESP policy too, so no images. rpeh •TCE 16:41, 10 June 2010 (UTC)


Choco chip cookie.png
You have been given a cookie!

Your dedication and diligence to the wiki has not gone unnoticed. A user has seen the progress you've made, and has given you a cookie because of it. Good work! The user had the following to say:

Thank you for all your help, it is extremely usefull Mikeyboy5216:26, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
You're very welcome! Robin HoodTalk 16:44, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
I'd give you a plate full of cookies, but couldnt find the template. If we had a "editor" of the month, I'd vote for you. :P MikeTalk 14:55, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
One is plenty, but just for future reference, all of the prize templates can be found in Category:Prize Templates. Robin Hoodtalk 16:14, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
Thanks! Now I dont have to stick to just one (boring) prize :D MikeTalk 16:17, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Yet Another Question[edit]

What are all the things like #preview? What do they do?--TheAlbinoOrc 16:27, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

Where do I start? There are a few overlapping concepts here, but the short answer to your question is that they're Magic Words (our page/Wikipedia's page). In addition to the ones that come built in to MediaWiki, you can also add extensions to them. In particular, the extensions you'll commonly see in use here on UESP are Parser Functions, StringFunctions, and Nephele's extremely useful MetaTemplate. Much like ~~~~ generates a signature, they allow you to create text where you don't know in advance what the outcome will be, or to make decisions about what to display based on that text.
A very simple example would be something like {{SITENAME}}, which displays "UESPWiki". In practice, most people would just type UESPWiki or shorten it to UESP, but suppose I wanted to be sure (for documentation, or similar) that I always displayed the site's correct name, even if Dave decided to change it. {{SITENAME}} would give me the ability to do that. As a more complex example, I could do something like this:
{{#ifeq:{{SITENAME}}|UESPWiki|Yup, this is still UESPWiki.|We've changed our name! We're now known as {{SITENAME}}.}}
...which would generate this if our name is UESPWiki: "Yup, this is still UESPWiki.", but this if we're not (note that I've had to deliberately fudge the example, since we are still UESPWiki): "We've changed our name! We're now known as UESPWiki." (With that last word being whatever the current name of the site is.)
This is a large part of what template programming's all about, really. If you want to know more, see the various links above, as well as our Template help page or Wikipedia's. Robin HoodTalk 17:08, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
Thanks for the help ! Also since this seems to be semi-related how I would make a sortable table sort?--TheAlbinoOrc 17:27, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
Whoops! Found the Help:Tables page which seems to answer this question.--TheAlbinoOrc 17:29, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

Signature Problems[edit]

This TheAlbinoOrc for some reason the wiki say it's an invalid raw signature check HTML tags. Any thoughts on why ?--TheAlbinoOrc 21:19, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

Try putting the "MidnightBlue" in quotes. Robin Hoodtalk 21:36, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
Thanks! It worked ! (Although why that made any difference I don't know)--TheAlbinoOrc 21:46, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
Wiki's probably just a little pickier about these things than the HTML standard is. Robin Hoodtalk 21:49, 10 June 2010 (UTC)


Ah ok, I wasn't aware of that. I usually patrol all user talk pages cos I figured a massive orange banner at the top of the page is enough for a message to be noticed :P Thanks in any case. --SerCenKing Talk 22:10, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

It usually is, but Patrollers/Admins tend to have their fingers in a lot of pies (as I'm sure you know) and some of them find it easier to keep track of things if they're patrolling talk pages or discussions they're involved in themselves. Besides that, the massive orange banner goes away the instant you look at your talk page; the teeny-weeny red exclamation marks don't. :) Robin Hoodtalk 22:14, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

Im going crazy trying to figure out..[edit]

Do you have any idea how I might use the actual daedric font on a signature? UESP has the file at least, but idk how to apply it without using images... Mike/|\ 22:37, 10 June 2010 (UTC)

Like this! :) Note that the "line-height" portion isn't strictly necessary; you may want to remove it or change the value until it looks right in your signature alongside other text. Those that don't have the Daedric Font installed will get something in whatever the default font for "Serif" is on their system. If you really want, you can list several alternatives, for example: <span style="line-height:0.9; font-family:Oblivion,Times,Arial,Serif">. Robin Hoodtalk 22:56, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
On a related note why does this
<span style="font-family:Monotype Corsivia">
<span style="text-shadow:grey 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em"><font color=MidnightBlue>[[User:TheAlbinoOrc|'''TheAlbinoOrc''']]</font></span> 
look exactly the same as this
<span style="font-family:Lucidia Handwriting">
<span style="text-shadow:grey 0.2em 0.2em 0.4em"><font color=MidnightBlue>[[User:TheAlbinoOrc|'''TheAlbinoOrc''']]</font></span> 
even though both fonts look quite different in Microsoft Word?--TheAlbinoOrc 23:45, 10 June 2010 (UTC)
All I can say is that it's a good freakin' thing I collect fonts and look through my list regularly or I could've looked at that forever without understanding what was going on. :) You've got typos in both font names. Once I correct the names, they appear as expected:
TheAlbinoOrc TheAlbinoOrc
Also, as you can see, you can probably combine the two spans into one. Robin Hoodtalk 00:40, 11 June 2010 (UTC)
Thanks! That would explain why the coding looked right. 8)--TheAlbinoOrc 19:52, 11 June 2010 (UTC)

Sheogoraths protection[edit]

checked it just now, I thought it was curious... For the Molag quest you keep your weapon. For sheogoraths protection I'm still trying to manage to *die* MikeTalk 18:06, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

Hehehe. Thanks for the follow-up, it can be hard to do that sort of thing and still keep the "rhythm" going when you're patrolling. I'll be curious to see what you find out! Robin Hoodtalk 18:22, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
I'll have to do it in a few hours, its 2am here. I'll check it as soon as i wake up. MikeTalk 18:26, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
I dropped the weapon when "dead" but 2/3 could find them when I went back to look for them. Tested with apostle daggers. reduced health to 12 with enchantments before I cast the spell than got hit. MikeTalk 23:17, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
Feel free to update the page appropriately. Robin Hoodtalk 23:24, 12 June 2010 (UTC)
I have, but I'm not so sure about the wording. Does it look alright? MikeTalk 01:35, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
Looks great to me. I just dropped it straight into place at Shivering:Spells#Sheogorath's Protection. Robin Hoodtalk 03:28, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Time for another Challenge![edit]

I have a strong feeling that after your recent work with templates and archive pages, you need a bit of good old bug investigation - so I figured I'd come to your rescue with this weirdness; it is the problem located here. It is very odd and it definitely surprised me a lot when I actually made it happen. Since this should be mentioned on all the related NPC pages (provided we can explain it) and the Skooma Den page as well, it would be great if you could give it a shot and see, if you can figure out what happens. As usual, no rush or anything. All the best! --Krusty 14:12, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

They all have a "find" package for 10 bottles of skooma. That means, because they took all of the skooma,they now have none and the conditions are set. They go to the plaza and will just wander looking for skooma within 5000 feet. Killing Roxanne had nothing to do with the weird schedule. They should all return to sleep at midnight as usual but now spend 8 until midnight looking for skooma in the plaza.--Corevette789 14:38, 13 June 2010 (UTC)
See my response on the Skooma Den talk page. Robin Hoodtalk 16:39, 13 June 2010 (UTC)


What exactly are "contents", like the They seem to be a different server of uesp, because I was able to access content3 but not regular just earlier. -- 17:30, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

That's exactly right—they're different servers on UESP. I don't know much more about our server configuration than that, though. The site owner, Daveh was aware of the problem, and has fixed it now. Robin Hoodtalk 17:39, 13 June 2010 (UTC)

Archive-By Date Problems[edit]

Can you take a look at the problem here? I asked Nephele about this but then realized that if she's to busy to work on Meta-Template she's probably to busy to mess with.--TheAlbinoOrcGot_a_question? 18:21, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

If you have a look at Category:Categories, it becomes more obvious what's going on: it's only counting the number of sub-categories in the category, not the number of pages. What I don't remember is if that's the expected behaviour or not. It might have to do with Nephele's new catpagetemplate functionality and/or how it's interacting with the CategoryTree extension. I think it's probably best for her to respond so we're sure. A workaround you can use if you're monitoring those categories is to save a category tree on your own page (or sandbox, etc.) that'll show the page count instead of the category count. You can do that like this:
<categorytree mode="pages" hideroot="on" showcount="on">Archive-By Date</categorytree>
Robin Hoodtalk 18:43, 15 June 2010 (UTC)

Chart Troubles[edit]

Can you take a look at the chart I'm trying to make here? I can't seem to connect Katalia and Fernus to anyone below them.--TheAlbinoOrcGot_a_question? 23:43, 18 June 2010 (UTC)

I just made a quick edit to the sandbox. Was that what you were looking for? Robin Hoodtalk 01:49, 19 June 2010 (UTC)
Yep, that's what I wanted. Thanks!!!--TheAlbinoOrcGot_a_question? 14:51, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

More, Fun With Skooma![edit]

Can you check to see if Roxanne retains ownership of the Skooma even if it's white? She keeps killing Reistrer the Rotted when I try to test this glitch.--TheAlbinoOrcGot_a_question? 14:55, 19 June 2010 (UTC)

I would need to know more about what you're doing in order to test it, but as far as I know, if the icon is white when you try to grab something, that means that either you own it (directly or by faction membership) or nobody does. My best guess without seeing what's going on specifically, would be that Reistrer is stealing something (probably from Roxanne herself) and Roxanne is reacting to it. I don't see anything anywhere that assigns ownership of anything to Roxanne specifically. Robin Hoodtalk 20:55, 19 June 2010 (UTC)
I'm putting two bottles of skooma on the ground next to a bread loaf and a carrot, in front of Roxanne and Reistrer. I may have gotten the bread or carrot from the Mages guild also. Could my having gone to jail after dumping the skooma have something to do with it?--TheAlbinoOrcGot_a_question? 23:36, 19 June 2010 (UTC)
I doubt it. So basically, you're stealing all the skooma from the Skooma Den, then putting the two bottles and food on the ground? Is the skooma on the ground from the Skooma Den? or did you get it somewhere else? Robin Hoodtalk 01:21, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
From the Skooma Den. In fact I'm reasonably sure that the skooma was from Reistrer himself.--TheAlbinoOrcGot_a_question? 04:29, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
I'll give it a try later today and see if I can replicate the behaviour, then see if I can figure out why it's happening. Robin Hoodtalk 18:31, 20 June 2010 (UTC)
I did the same things you did (I think) and got the same results. As near as I can tell, the only time Roxanne goes hostile is after Reistrer has stolen Skooma from her. And I believe it's almost always those two simply because of their relative movement speeds. Robin Hoodtalk 02:32, 21 June 2010 (UTC)


any idea whats up with User:Mh46278 user page? MikeTalk 11:43, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

Looks like he was just experimenting with various things. Judging from what's there, I think he probably just clicked randomly on several of the buttons just above the edit window and then saved the page. Robin Hoodtalk 16:11, 20 June 2010 (UTC)

RE: Image in Signature[edit]

Thanks. I understand. --Michaeldsuarez (Talk) (Deeds) 12:39, 21 June 2010 (UTC)

MW Spell Formula[edit]

Can you take a look at this glitch? We think that there's something wrong with the formula.--TheAlbinoOrcGot_a_question? 21:16, 23 June 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, I don't know Morrowind at all, so I can't even test things. Having a look at the discussion, I can't figure out anything more than you guys have already. Robin Hoodtalk 22:03, 23 June 2010 (UTC)


Do you mind if I ask how you did the quote thing? And how I could use it to put my own quotes on my userpage? MikeTalk 14:48, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

Couldn't you ask an easier question? :) Just remember, you asked for it! If you look at the history of User:Joram and my own history, you'll see that it really built in complexity over time. There are some places where it could probably have been coded better and I'll probably tweak/re-write it at some point, but here's a breakdown of it as it exists now at a moderate level of detail. Ask me if you need help with anything specific.

Main Page

The important part of the code on my main page is:
The rest is just formatting to put the quote beside the userboxes.
  • The number in {{#local:numpages|6}} tells the /Random subpage how many pages exist. As-designed, the /Random# pages must be consecutive from 1 to this number in order for the Prev/Next buttons to work. You could probably work around that and use any page name you wanted (e.g., /TheCrystalGazer, /RHsEasterEggs) with some extra coding, but it would add needless complexity and I really didn't see any special need to do that.
  • The next line is what actually does the work.
    • {{FULLPAGENAME0}}/Random just transcludes User:RobinHood70/Random, but does it in a way that if you copy the code to another user's page (like your own), it'll correctly look at their /Random page instead of mine, while still appearing as expected if you were to transclude the entire page somewhere else. Just using {{/Random}} on its own would fail to do this. It's not likely my page will ever be transcluded anywhere else, but I try to code "safely" when I think of it and when it's something that may be moved or copied somewhere else.
    • The part after the pipe is just a parameter to tell /Random which page to display.
      1. It first tries to get the "pgnum" argument from the URL itself. So if you were to look at, you would always see "The Crystal Gazer". This parameter in the URL is what makes the Prev/Next buttons able to work.
      2. If it doesn't find a "pgnum" in the URL, #pickfrom randomly chooses any page but 3. This makes page 3 an Easter Egg that you can only get to by the Prev/Next buttons or by typing it into the URL.
So looking at it in full, with page 6 as an example, after parsing everything, MediaWiki would see it as: {{User:RobinHood70/Random|6}}.

/Random Page

This page essentially creates and handles the Prev/Next buttons, and then transcludes the appropriate subpage.
  • The two formulas are basically just programming tricks to increase or decrease the page number, but wrap around properly if you're at the first or last page.
    • {{{1}}}±1 is fairly obvious - it just adds or subtracts one from the current page number (which is stored in {{{1}}}).
    • ± {{{numpages}}} * ({{{1|1}}} = 1 or {{{numpages}}}) basically says that if the page is currently equal to 1 or equal to {{{numpages}}}, add or subtract {{{numpages}}}. This is what creates the wraparound effect. If, for example, the current page is 1 and you clicked Prev, you'd get 1 - 1 + 6 = 6.
Okay, so now at the very bottom of the page, we transclude the correct page as passed to this page in the {{{1}}} parameter, or defaulting to 1 if nothing was passed and we're looking at the page directly.

/Random# Pages

After this, it's relatively easy. There are no special wiki tricks on these pages other than the fact that the formatting is a little complex, using tables within tables at times, so that it shrinks or expands to fit the page width without getting too screwy at unusually small or large widths. User:RobinHood70/Random6 is probably the simplest example, where User:RobinHood70/Random1 is probably the most complex. And we just won't talk about /Random3. ;) Robin Hoodtalk 17:03, 28 June 2010 (UTC)
Ok, I get it, basically, make a few of my own pages like [[User:Mikeyboy52/Random1]] all the way to 6 or however many than use that first code. Thanks for the help, I looked at the code before but wasn't absolutely sure What codes were used :D MikeTalk 18:51, 28 June 2010 (UTC)
No problem, glad I could help. Robin Hoodtalk 19:42, 28 June 2010 (UTC)
Oh, and if you don't want the Prev/Next buttons, the code becomes much simpler. All you need on your main page is: {{ {{FULLPAGENAME0}}/Random{{#pickfrom:1|2|3|...}} }} and then start creating random pages in sequence and change the pickfrom accordingly. Note that that code was written off the top of my head and not tested in any way. Robin Hoodtalk 22:42, 28 June 2010 (UTC)

Signature Problems Part 2[edit]

I'm trying to integrate the fire effect seen here into my signature but I can't seem to get it to work for some reason. (As can been seen here User:TheAlbinoOrc/Sandbox/8). Any ideas on what I'm doing wrong ?--TheAlbinoOrcGot_a_question? 21:23, 30 June 2010 (UTC)

I just updated your sandbox. As you can see from the edit summary, it was just an extra quote. Robin Hoodtalk 21:36, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
Or so it seemed. The invalid HTML tag is coming up again but I can't figure out where to put whatever needs to be put in (coding isn't really one of my strengths) so what's wrong with it do you think?--TheAlbinoOrcGot_a_question? 21:45, 30 June 2010 (UTC)
Your signature's too long now. You'll have to use a sub-page like I'm doing (User:RobinHood70/sig) and then change the signature box to {{subst:User:TheAlbinoOrc/Sig}} (where "Sig" is, of course, whatever you want to name your subpage).
Odd. What I have in preferences is this: {{subst:User:TheAlbinoOrc/Signature/1}} but that's what shows up is (complete with these {{}}) {{subst:User:TheAlbinoOrc/Signature/1}}. What did I do wrong this time?--{{subst:User:TheAlbinoOrc/Signature/1}} 03:45, 1 July 2010 (UTC)
Okay, I'm officially an idiot. What I should have put (and now have) is {{subst:User:TheAlbinoOrc/Sandbox/Signature/1}} not {{subst:User:TheAlbinoOrc/Signature/1}}.--TheAlbinoOrcGot_a_question? 03:48, 1 July 2010 (UTC)
Welcome to the club! Also, I think you forgot to nowiki the template names above...I just put it in in the message above in case anybody else is following along and doesn't spot it. It took me a couple of tries, wondering why I'd been able to find the page in a search (which I did more by accident the first time than intentionally), but couldn't access it directly. Then I spotted the difference in names. ;) Robin Hoodtalk 05:06, 1 July 2010 (UTC)

Another Day - Another Buggy NPC[edit]

Hey Rob! You probably didn't notice, but I added you to the "permission group" in my Sandbox. I really hope you are up for another challenge, because I am at the point where there is absolutely nothing more I can do in-game - and this one seems to be even worse than Fathis Ules when it comes to bugs and strangeness. As you can see, I have written an almost complete (and very bugged) in-game schedule, have gathered ALL information from all the talk pages and quest pages and divided the info into the Bugs and Questions sections. Corevette have already started investigating some of it (and I am checking the facts in-game as we go along) but we need your expertise as a PC-user, not only to check what bugs the UOP fixes, but for general investigation both in-game and CS. You might also want to read through the Sandbox's talk page once again. Of course and as usual, only do this if you have the time and feel like spending too much time on a bugged lizard. Hope to see you on the page! Oh, and btw, it might be useful if we discuss this investigation in one place - and that could be on the Sandbox's talk page. --Krusty 07:22, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

Would we split up a discussion? Not on this wiki! ROFL! I'm about to go for lunch, but I'll try to have a look at it later today. Robin Hoodtalk 17:44, 3 July 2010 (UTC)
Blah. Really tired and out of it right now, but I'll add it to my Bring Forward list, so I should get to it in the next day or two, whenever I'm feeling more up to it. Robin Hoodtalk 20:11, 3 July 2010 (UTC)
No rush or anything! It is only human not being up to spending hours on a lizard with, what, 20 bugged AI packages? --Krusty 20:27, 3 July 2010 (UTC)
Yup 20 exactly. This is worse than Fathis.--Corevette789 21:51, 3 July 2010 (UTC)
Hey RH. I know we nailed Amusei, but to finish things off, I was wondering if you would add a ScheduleChecked and your signature to the ONPCRP tag? I'm asking because, right now, you and I know the schedule and all the bugs by heart. But two months from now, it might prove problematic to remember exactly why we wrote the schedule and the bugs the way we did (which is exactly how I feel about the Mirabelle Monet page) - so if you agree with the written Amusei-schedule, I would be very happy if you could finish it off. All the best! --Krusty 20:45, 22 July 2010 (UTC)
Done. Robin Hoodtalk 23:45, 22 July 2010 (UTC)

"If I only had a brain" - Tincan Man ( I think) and me[edit]

Do you know how I can add a message on my signature template page, without messing up my signature?MikeTalk 06:32, 6 July 2010 (UTC)

Use <noinclude>The text you want to display.</noinclude> and you should be good to go. Robin Hoodtalk 16:02, 6 July 2010 (UTC)
Trivia time! The Scarecrow sang "If I Only Had a Brain"; The Tin Man sang "If I Only Had a Heart", and The Cowardly Lion, by the way, sang "If I Only Had the Noive". :) --GKtalk2me 22:43, 9 July 2010 (UTC)

Timothee LaRouche[edit]

Hey RH! Remember Mirabelle Monet and all the fun we had with her? Well, since then, I wrote a schedule for Timothee and added a half-baked bug description to the page, based on some of your observations for Mirabelle. I clearly remember that it was my intention to ask you to correct it, but I must have forgot. Now, a friendly user reminded me that the bug description is a bit... lacking. Question is, do you remember anything about this moving bed phenomenon? We should give Timothee and his page a proper bug note instead of my blurry scribblings... --Krusty 00:19, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

I asked for follow-up on when the bed-moving phenomenon occurred and never received it (see the very end of this section). As far as I know, it was strictly a pathing problem. Robin Hoodtalk 21:23, 10 July 2010 (UTC)
Ack, you're right - I remember you asking for a follow-up (and I'll have to admit being too tired to read through that entire MM-investigation last night). Too bad that anon never returned with some input. Nevertheless, hopefully we will be able to figure out what to do with both Timothee and Mirabelle in due time. Thanks for the reply in my Sandbox - seems like the bug description is accurate and that the UOP fixes the problem altogether. I must admit, this is the biggest bug I have seen during my 16 months on the ONPCRP. --Krusty 21:33, 10 July 2010 (UTC)

Chart Again[edit]

I can't seem to get Andrel to link to Casynder for some reason (neither can Jplatinum16). Any ideas on why?--TheAlbinoOrcany_questions? 15:47, 13 July 2010 (UTC)

Never mind actually - Rpeh cleared it up while I was typing the previous message.--TheAlbinoOrcany_questions? 15:54, 13 July 2010 (UTC)


Choco chip cookie.png
You have been given a cookie!

Your dedication and diligence to the wiki has not gone unnoticed. A user has seen the progress you've made, and has given you a cookie because of it. Good work! The user had the following to say:

Thank you so much for your tireless work on all the problematic NPCs! To name a few; Fathis Ules, Mirabelle Monet, Kantav Cheynoslin and, last but not least, the lizard from hell: Amusei. All of these pages exist because of your efforts and investigations and it has been a lot of fun solving all the different mysteries. Here's hoping we can continue the work in the future! --Krusty 07:21, 14 July 2010 (UTC)

When you get the time[edit]

Me and Krusty put together the real list for the IC waterfront and we once again cant align the tables like we want them. Its here. I put up a wanted sign too just in case :D--Corevette789 22:24, 17 July 2010 (UTC)

Done. Robin Hoodtalk 03:43, 18 July 2010 (UTC)
That's beautiful! I'll pick apart that coding right now. I really hope you are feeling a bit better.--Corevette789 03:53, 18 July 2010 (UTC)

Question about leveled NPCs[edit]

Hi, RH. Sorry to bother you, but I'm hoping you can help me with something. I've been trying to figure out how to write health and magicka param for leveled NPCs for a time, luckily right now I almost have it nailed down. However there's still something that I can't seem to nail down.

As I understand the bit PC=1-91 (this is for Mankar Camoran) indicates the player levels at which the formula is applicable, in this case from level 1 to level 91 because at that level MC strenght or endurance hits 100, meaning that a new formula is needed. The problem is this: how do you determine the maximum level at which the formula is applicable? I ask this because I've tried with several NPCs to see if there's a special equation to determine it but to no avail, so I'm hoping you can help me with this. Thanks in advance! --S'drassa T2M 19:29, 19 July 2010 (UTC)

I've never understood the levelled formulae, sorry. :) Robin Hoodtalk 20:56, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
Really? It's just that since I saw you participated in this conversation I thought you might know how it worked. Well, I'll try asking rpeh. Thanks anyway :-) --S'drassa T2M 21:11, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
Yeah, I didn't really understand how they worked back then either, I was just using the example given by Nephele and expanding it to several lines (except I think I messed it up on re-reading it, but I'm not gonna correct a 3-year-old convo). Robin Hoodtalk 21:21, 19 July 2010 (UTC)
The NPC has the same restrictions as the player, most importantly that their attributes max out at 100. This means that once their strength or endurance hits 100, the formulae stop being valid. Take the example of a knight. Knights gain 3 strength per level. If they start at 50 endurance, then they can only gain 16 levels before they run into the attribute cap. There's a bit more to it than that, but you get the basic idea. rpeh •TCE 07:51, 20 July 2010 (UTC)

A photography page?[edit]

TheEnigmaticMan wishes to ask a question. He wishes to know whether there is a photography page or whether something like that has been attempted in the past? TheEnigmaticMan 15:31, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

I don't believe it has, at least not as a general page. Some people, like rpeh keep a photo album in their user space, however. Like the Must Have Mods page, something like that would be prone to debate, so it might be best to keep it in user space. If desired, you could then create a Photography category, just to have everybody's photography pages listed in one place. Robin Hoodtalk 18:20, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

Quest Header Template[edit]

Re Morrowind:A Falling Wizard. Please fix. rpeh •TCE 00:00, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

While I'll fix the template, that highlights a problem with the page: there's a Start parameter without a Giver parameter, which is not allowed. Robin Hoodtalk 01:10, 4 August 2010 (UTC)

Alessia Caro pt 2[edit]

Hey Rob! I have no idea why I forgot our little investigation a few months back, but I still managed to do the page, mostly because of your discoveries. Still, one thing worries me - what exactly does the UOP do to poor Alessia when she is supposed to travel to Chorrol? I am asking because you wrote that the UOP makes its own bug - and it would be good to get that sorted out. --Krusty 19:33, 7 August 2010 (UTC)

The problem was that all of her Chorrol packages required that the player be at less than stage 20 of Ahdarji's Heirloom and at stage 30 or above at the same time. Since it's impossible to be both at the same time, none of the Chorrol packages ever executed with the final version of the UOP. These have been fixed with the UOP Supplemental fixes as of v3.2.6 and above, though. Robin Hoodtalk 22:22, 7 August 2010 (UTC)


Hi there, been away for a while so may be completely off the mark here, but well done on your new blocking rights! Well deserved Corvus 20:25, 9 August 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, Corvus, though I don't really consider it anything special, just something a little extra to help out with occasional bouts of vandalism. Robin Hoodtalk 22:11, 9 August 2010 (UTC)


Why are you making all these changes to users' pages when you could just define a new variable in the template? rpeh •TCE 23:02, 10 August 2010 (UTC)

To standardize the parameters that're used so that they're the same throughout all templates. There's only about 40 of them, so I figured it was worth it (especially for the second unnamed parameter to text). If there'd been really large amounts of them, I would've done as you suggested. Robin Hoodtalk 23:05, 10 August 2010 (UTC)


That debate is out of date. The debate about archiving and categories is more recent and takes precedence. The system you proposed would result in huge archives that would be totally unreadable. Please keep them at around the 30K limit as usual. rpeh •TCE 18:19, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

I didn't see the one as invalidating the other. When was a 30K limit established? If we keep to a size like that, I expect AN and CP will quickly develop far too many archives to be useful. I don't see archives as needing to be "readable" as a whole, they need to be "searchable", which they are. Also, in the second proposal, there was one for (myself, as proposer), one against (you), which meant it went nowhere; the previous policy therefore stands, which meant archiving by date plus archiving important topics. Robin Hoodtalk 18:28, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
The 30K limit is established by the wiki software - surely you've seen the message about saving pages >30K?
In 5 1/2 years of the wiki, we've reached 15 AN archives and 19 CP archives. At that rate we'll hit 100 CP archives in another 23 years.
The trouble is that under your two proposals, the archives would not be searchable unless you knew a phrase you wanted. By breaking them up and categorising, there's at least a chance you can find things. rpeh •TCE 18:34, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
Yes, I've seen the 32kb warning, though I've yet to hear of a browser that actually had that limit. Also, there's nothing preventing breaking up and categorizing, but the numeric archives can still follow a chronological format. The larger point is that you're taking independent action in contravention of currently established consensus, albeit a very small consensus. If you want to do that, you should bring up another discussion on CP or AN and mention these points in that discussion. Until then, at least on the Administrator Noticeboard where the initial discussion took place, the archives should follow the chronological order previously discussed with transcluded pages of important discussions. Robin Hoodtalk 18:53, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
I dunno what consensus you're referring to. A debate ignored by everybody except one infrequent contributor doesn't establish a consensus in my book. I'm sticking with the way it's always been done, thanks. rpeh •TCE 19:02, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
As I said, it's a small consensus, but nobody spoke up against it. If you want to do it the old way, you should ensure that that's the way others want to do it as well. Your book is not the only book. In my book, it was a consensus. Once again, since there seems to be some debate as to what's wanted, we should be putting it to the community, not deciding for ourselves. Last I heard, though, there were two people who agreed on the method, and nobody who disagreed. Since you didn't speak up at the time, the appropriate action is for you to post to the AN or CP and ask for a new consensus. Robin Hoodtalk 19:18, 18 August 2010 (UTC)
I have many more important and useful things to do. If you think that you really had the support to change a system that had worked fine since the wiki was set up, you go right ahead. rpeh •TCE 19:24, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

() I already did! That's what this entire conversation has been about. You're acting independently at this point, not following what was previously established. Robin Hoodtalk 19:28, 18 August 2010 (UTC)

I would like to express my thanks[edit]

I dont know what me and S'drassa Coulda done if you hadnt steped in there. Thanks man, I dont know how long we Coulda kept reverting. 02:21, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

You're welcome. I'm going to ask Nephele about the possibilities of Tor blocking. I've done a little homework, and it looks like there's two different possibilities, both of which seem like they'd be pretty easy to implement for either her or Dave. Robin Hoodtalk 02:50, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

Don't Interfere[edit]

Please don't start an edit war. It's none of your business. rpeh •TCE 09:09, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Agreed, please don't start an edit war against policy. You can take this up on the Admin Noticeboard where I've posted a request. It is not your right to delete warnings on your own pages. And that is policy! Also, telling me "it's none of your business" is dismissing my concerns without discussion. We've already got one user who's been reprimanded for that, as I recall. Robin Hoodtalk 09:16, 23 August 2010 (UTC)
The difference is that this is already a discussion I've had with two admins and resolved. You were nothing to do with that, so when I say it's none of your business, I mean it. rpeh •TCE 09:22, 23 August 2010 (UTC)
Then I'm sure it will be a matter of public record that you were allowed to delete a block message from RoBoT's talk page, as opposed to archiving block messages on your own talk page. If you would kindly point me to that discussion, then I'll be happy to apologize for the misunderstanding and move on. As I said, I don't do this to harass you, but to delete a warning message completely, without explicit Admin permission, just because you feel it was invalid, sets a very bad precedent. By that same precedent, Elliot should have been allowed to remove his notices because he most certainly felt they were invalid. Robin Hoodtalk 09:26, 23 August 2010 (UTC)
No. Just as I didn't delete the warnings given to me, Elliot can't delete the warnings given to him. Warnings given to RoBoT, however, are totally different. There was no call for them to be given in the first place, and in the second place, since the block was directed at ME, its removal is covered by the previous discussion. To keep a block notice, made out of vindictiveness, on the page of a user who has never broken policy, is nonsense. rpeh •TCE 09:33, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

TOR Testing[edit]

This is RobinHood70 testing TOR usage. The first four or five times, I got a standard block message from either Ratwar or Timenn having manually blocked the IP. This time, I didn't, and I can edit normally. We'll see what happens when I submit the edit, though. 23:02, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

No TOR for you! Oh wait, yes there is, but that's cuz I'm logged in as myself now. Robin Hoodtalk 23:36, 23 August 2010 (UTC)

Have some food[edit]

Choco chip cookie.png
You have been given a cookie!

Your dedication and diligence to the wiki has not gone unnoticed. A user has seen the progress you've made, and has given you a cookie because of it. Good work! The user had the following to say:

For you heroic messing around with userboxes, and all the other recent hard work you have been putting into the wiki. Jadrax 19:35, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
Thank you! Oh and I love your wording: "heroic messing around". :) Robin Hoodtalk 19:37, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

Removing custom userbox with trademarked image[edit]

Couldn't you simply have removed the image as opposed to the whole userbox? Better yet, replaced it with a non-copyrighted image instead? While I both acknowledge and respect the reason behind these edits, I'd prefer to minimize the gaping holes in tables on my user page. Just a suggestion, thanks for your help keeping UESP in compliance with copyright laws. Ulthripe talk 23:28, 24 August 2010 (UTC)

Yeah, I talked about it with Krusty and we decided to remove the entire box for simplicity's sake. There's no reason users can't put them back, minus the image, of course. I'm happy to do this either way, though. If you want, just bring it up in the Community Portal discussion so it's clear, and users can comment on their preference, and I'll follow whatever people decide. I'll hold off on doing any more until there's a decision there. Robin Hoodtalk 23:34, 24 August 2010 (UTC)
Update: I asked the community myself. I can see advantages and disadvantages to both, but I suspect you're right and that most people will probably prefer that only the image be removed. I'll give it a day or two and see if anybody says anything. Robin Hoodtalk 01:12, 25 August 2010 (UTC)


Could you check my userpage and look at my userbox section, i have one that says how long ive been on uesp but now its messed up. I've been gone awhile so missed out any discussions about it. If it's the code could you please point out where? MikeTalk 03:19, 28 August 2010 (UTC)

I just worked on that one today, and obviously I goofed somewhere. There's nothing wrong on your end, so I'll have a look at the template code. Thanks for letting me know! Robin Hoodtalk 03:21, 28 August 2010 (UTC)
Okay, all fixed. It only affected users who started this year. Robin Hoodtalk 03:35, 28 August 2010 (UTC)


Could you give me a hand with the warning on SkoomaManiac's page? The link to Rpeh's page takes me to Ulmesi Baryon for some reason.--TheAlbinoOrcany_questions? 06:35, 29 August 2010 (UTC)

Done. --Krusty 07:25, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
Well, that was certainly a special link on several levels...not sure what happened there. Sorry I couldn't help — I was busy playing Vampire the Masquerade: Redemption. Glad Krusty got it. Robin Hoodtalk 08:00, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
Was this really worth a warning? It was an irrelevant comment but hardly a personal attack. rpeh •TCE 08:19, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
I was thinking the exact same thing, but wanted to wait and see what you said. I'll take that warning off and make it an advice instead. --Krusty 08:47, 29 August 2010 (UTC)
I'm in the same boat as Krusty. I wasn't sure what to make of it, so I was just going to leave it and let you figure out how to take it, but since TAO issued the warning anyway, I let it stand (other than correcting it). Robin Hoodtalk 08:53, 29 August 2010 (UTC)


I'll make this short. I'd like to express my sympathy for your difficulties with Chronic Fatigue Syndrome. I am housebound under similar circumstances, Chronic Lyme Disease, and the fact that you've pushed yourself to find work impresses me. Anyways. If I knew how to give you a cookie I would. Good luck with your troubles. -- Ålchemist

Thank you! It's always nice to meet someone who can understand my circumstances. I read a little bit about Chronic Lyme Disease while I was still trying to understand what was happening with me, and you certainly have my sympathy in return! As for work, I pushed myself initially, but eventually it became clear to me that while I might want to work and I might think I could work, from an employer's perspective, I was unemployable due to the CFS. So now, I'm trying to get on disability.
And to give cookies or other "prizes" (see Prize Templates), simply type {{prize name|your message ~~~~}}, so for example: {{Cookie|Here's how to give a cookie. ~~~~}} would produce:
Choco chip cookie.png
You have been given a cookie!

Your dedication and diligence to the wiki has not gone unnoticed. A user has seen the progress you've made, and has given you a cookie because of it. Good work! The user had the following to say:

Here's how to give a cookie. Robin Hoodtalk 20:43, 1 September 2010 (UTC)
Sometimes, with more complex formatting (like my signature), you'll need to add a "message=" in front of your message, but most users/messages won't require it. Just thought I'd mention it in case you notice the discrepancy between what I said and what I did. :) Robin Hoodtalk 20:43, 1 September 2010 (UTC)

You Are Formally Requested[edit]

To partake of the excellent food and company offered at the monthly Feast of Welcome, hosted by Countess Ariana Valga to celebrate her daughter's visit.

(Signed) TheAlbinoOrc

By authority of Ariana Valga, Countess Chorrol

Actually we need your help with some CS checking on Hlidara Mothril, but it sounds better to invite you to a Feast of Welcome :D.--TheAlbinoOrcany_questions? 14:41, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Okay, I replied there. Let me know if I missed anything. Robin Hoodtalk 17:13, 7 September 2010 (UTC)

Kurdan Again[edit]

Could you take another look at the discussion on Krusty's page? I just realized S'drassa's theory won't work, so no-one has any idea what he's doing.--TAOHuh? 22:16, 15 September 2010 (UTC)

Warning Borders[edit]

Please can you explain why Warnings now have no observable borders? After spending 10 minutes trying to make my way through the nested mess that now makes up the warning template, I gave up. I've always assumed you were going to fix this at some point but it seems not. Please fix it now. rpeh •TCE 23:10, 16 September 2010 (UTC)

I followed the standards that seemed to be used in several templates and tried to harmonize them as best as possible. We had varying colours and borders all over the place! I've darkened the current borders to match the old colours on UESPWiki:Messages. For future reference, the {{Message}} template is the one that I'm trying to use for site-wide standardization, and has all the commonly-used site colours in it. Robin Hoodtalk 00:00, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

Just Curious[edit]

Would setting up my signature page so that it randomizes make my signature randomize it whenever someone looked at a page I signed on or would it simply be whatever signature came up at that time would be put when I sign?--TAOHuh? 21:51, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

Unless your signature was itself a template (which isn't allowed), it would be whatever signature came up at the time you signed. Robin Hoodtalk 21:56, 17 September 2010 (UTC)

My Randomness[edit]

Is there any way to make it display properly without moving the page? I put up two poems about Cheydinhal I wrote, but I put them at User:TheAlbinoOrc/RandomPage/1 and User:TheAlbinoOrc/RandomPage/2 and it won't work right with the slash.--TAOHuh? 07:58, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

The first parameter to #pickfrom needs to be the number of items to pick (1), which is the main problem (i.e., it should be {{#pickfrom:1|/1|/2}}). If you want, you can also move the slash out in front of it, so it reads RandomPage/{{#pickfrom:1|1|2}}. Also, you should remove the trailing pipe, otherwise I think you'll randomly get a redlink there when it goes looking for RandomPage/ and doesn't find it. Robin Hoodtalk 08:14, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
This is what I'm currently using: {{ {{FULLPAGENAME0}}/RandomPage/{{#pickfrom:1|2|}} }}. Apparently it should be working but isn't for some reason. Maybe I didn't make one of the pages?--TAOHuh? 08:20, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
Bah, edit conflict. See the changes to my first reply. Robin Hoodtalk 08:36, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
Thanks! It now works right, as last time I visited my page it was displaying the first haiku about Cheydinhal. By the way since I'm here, do you know whether or not scripts are processed before weight? And also Kurdan the non-thief seems to be related to Graklak the invisible as far as behavior goes, is there any chance you could check that out at some point to see what's the same about them?--TAOHuh? 09:24, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
I saw the post on Kurdan's or Krusty's page...wherever it was...earlier but I didn't read it thoroughly. I'm on my way to bed right now. I'll read it more thoroughly and play around with it tomorrow and see what I can figure out. Robin Hoodtalk 09:34, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
That's fine - I just wanted to let you know so that it was easy to remember to check it.--TAOHuh? 09:52, 19 September 2010 (UTC)
Oh it seems even my online friends are starting to realize I need reminding of things. :Þ Having a look at it now, I'll let you know what I come up with. Robin Hoodtalk 16:23, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

() RH, I think both of us have looked at this problem over and over - for the longest time. Still, as it would be nice to solve somehow, so please don't hesitate to let me know if I can provide any kind of assistance in this neverending investigation. --Krusty 18:08, 19 September 2010 (UTC)

How can I do it?[edit]

I've noticed that you many other users welcome new users to this site by sending them a message like the one you send me. How can I do the same thing to newcomers? --Rigas Papadopoulos 15:54, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

There are a couple of ways, but the easiest way is while you're looking at the user's page, click on "User Contributions" in the Toolbox section on the left of your browser window, then at the very bottom of that page, there'll be a pale blue box with a "Welcome Editor" button in it. Just click on that button, enter "Welcome" into the Subject, and save the page. Robin Hoodtalk 16:51, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
Thanks but how I can I find new users? --Rigas Papadopoulos 17:50, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
If you're watching it closely enough, they'll show up in Recent Changes. Otherwise, you can click on "Special Pages", then click on "Logs" in the "Recent Changes and Logs" section. From the drop-down box, select "User Creation Log", then click on "Go". Or skip all that and just click here. Robin Hoodtalk 17:57, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
Thanks for the help. However there is still one problem, why I can not welcome a user that does not have a user page? --Rigas Papadopoulos 19:18, 21 September 2010 (UTC)
It's not that they don't have a user page, it's because they haven't made any contributions. In that case, you can go to UESPWiki:Messages and there's another copy of the Welcome message there that you can use. The only trick is that you have to remember to enter the correct name, since you're no longer on the user's page. Robin Hoodtalk 20:10, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Okay, thanks! --Rigas Papadopoulos 05:07, 22 September 2010 (UTC)


If I'm not mistaken, weren't the /Description pages deleted a long time ago? And if so, should the Patrolling Guidelines be changed to reflect this? -- Jplatinum16 22:36, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

Indeed they were. Go nuts! :) Robin Hoodtalk 22:38, 21 September 2010 (UTC)

True or False?[edit]

It is true that you are the second person that joined this site right after Daveh? --Rigas Papadopoulos 17:29, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

False. I believe that of the currently active users, I'm the longest active next to Daveh, but there were a great many people who joined before me...they're just not active on the site any more. Robin Hoodtalk 19:09, 23 September 2010 (UTC)

Okay I understand. Thanks! --Rigas Papadopoulos 05:02, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

Skills Summary[edit]

Is there a reason why the Skills Summary template doesn't automatically add a link for Morrowind specializations? (magic, stealth, combat). I'm guessing because that part was originally intended only for Oblivion specializations, but I see no reason it can't be applied to Morrowind now (especially since we now have two out of three Morrowind specialization pages). Is there a way you can fix the template, or will I have to manually put the links in per page? -- Jplatinum16 01:44, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

I remember looking at that at the time, but I don't remember the reasoning. I think maybe it was because there were only two of the three, or maybe I just didn't realize that it could be done for Morrowind. In any event, I see no particular reason we can't do it, so let me have a closer look and do some testing and I'll probably have it for you shortly. Robin Hoodtalk 02:35, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
Okay, done. Let me know if you spot any problems. Robin Hoodtalk 03:33, 24 September 2010 (UTC)
Everything seems to be in check. Thanks RH; now to start working on those stealth articles. -- Jplatinum16 00:51, 25 September 2010 (UTC)
I've made it so that it's easy to link Stealth to an article for Morrowind but not Oblivion or vice versa, so if at any point you create a {{NAMESPACE}}:Stealth article, it'll just take a second to link it instead of having it appear as plain text. Robin Hoodtalk 02:13, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Yes, Practice[edit]

You asked why I welcomed TheAlbinoOrc's old account to the site. I was for practice, I never welcomed a user before that so I wanted to do a test. --Rigas Papadopoulos 10:35, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

Okay, thanks for letting me know. Robin Hoodtalk 17:17, 24 September 2010 (UTC)

You're welcome. --Rigas Papadopoulos 08:11, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

A small favor[edit]

Hi, can you please block this guy please? Thanks! --S'drassa T2M 19:04, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

I'm just going to give it a sec to see if he does any more now that the warning has been issued. If he does, I'll block him after his next edit. Robin Hoodtalk 19:08, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Warning Messages[edit]

I've noticed that in some Contributions pages it the user or IP adress has made inappropriate edits and gives an option of warning the user or IP adress. Where can I see the inappropriate edits that they made to judge if they must be warned? --Rigas Papadopoulos 19:34, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Just look at the contributions they've made recently. Typically, the warning is used in cases of vandalism. If you're uncertain, you should leave it to the more experienced editors to give the warnings. It's not urgent that they be given in most cases, and it's better not to give one that might be needed than to give one to someone who was editing in good faith. Robin Hoodtalk 19:39, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Okay, thanks! --Rigas Papadopoulos 19:46, 25 September 2010 (UTC)

Teleportation Crash[edit]

Is it just with Sheogorath's script that it crashes or does it crash when doing other things that teleport you such as coc-ing, using Frostcrag Spire or doing the fighters guild quest that teleports you?--TAOHuh? 22:05, 26 September 2010 (UTC)

It didn't appear to be teleportation itself that was the problem, as I could use player.moveto just fine and end up in the right place. I didn't try any other teleporting quests. My guess is that it's something to do with the animation effect, but I couldn't get Sheogorath to do that for me (he'd just stand up and sit back down again). I just reinstalled a couple of weeks ago, and doing yet another reinstall today, but leaving it bare-bones with no patches, mods, OBMM, OBSE, etc., the same saved game worked fine, so I'm hoping that that'll help me track down the differences, since there wasn't a whole lot of customization or experimentation going on yet. Robin Hoodtalk 22:35, 26 September 2010 (UTC)
Just a thought and probably wrong but you might want to try re-installing the USIP first, since a lot of PC users probably got that to fix the Reference Bug and it of necessity affected everyone in SI.--TAOHuh? 22:56, 26 September 2010 (UTC)
That'll be early on, yeah. My plan is to go patches, OBMM, UOP, UO(other stuff), OBSE...then see what's left. Robin Hoodtalk 23:05, 26 September 2010 (UTC)


I noticed that your Bot has done few edits and is not very busy. Is there any specific reason for that? --Rigas Papadopoulos 08:42, 28 September 2010 (UTC) P.S. Just curious.

It's still very new, and I have concentration difficulties because of my illness (see my user page), so I don't work on it a lot. Robin Hoodtalk 08:54, 28 September 2010 (UTC)
Thanks for the information. About CFS, I read the Wikipedia page and it seems really bad. You are suffering from so heavy symptoms? --Rigas Papadopoulos 15:43, 28 September 2010 (UTC)
I'm mostly housebound because of how much energy it takes to get anywhere, though I get out to walk the dog most days. I'm also dizzy to some degree all the time, have constant ringing in my ears, and many days, both physically and mentally, I feel like I've been woken up in the middle of the night...I'm tired and can't always think clearly. Some days are better, though, and those are the days where I try to do the more challenging bot programming or template work. Summer is usually worse because the effects are magnified by allergies.
So long story short: yeah, the symptoms are pretty bad. But at the same time, I've heard of people who are worse off than I am, so I'm grateful that it's not worse. Robin Hoodtalk 19:42, 28 September 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for letting me know. I hope you get better. --Rigas Papadopoulos 07:59, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Thank you. Robin Hoodtalk 08:06, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

You're welcome. --Rigas Papadopoulos 13:07, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

So what language are bots coded in? How do you implement it on the wiki? Also Rigas can you please indent your posts by putting : these in front of them?--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 21:00, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
There are two general kinds of bots: those that run constantly on the wiki server itself (such as the signature bot on Wikipedia) and bots that run on-demand from an external computer. I believe that those that run directly on the wiki would normally be programmed in PHP, simply because that's the language MediaWiki itself uses, but I think you can use other languages if you want...Daveh or Nephele could probably answer that question better than I could. For bots that are running from a person's computer, though, they can be in any language that the computer itself can run...which is usually anything. rpeh and I are both using C#; I don't know what NepheleBot is using.
As to how they're implemented, there's low-level implementation and high-level implementation.
  • Low-level means you're specifying what to do directly via commands like you'll see in your browser bar when you click on a link (e.g.,
  • High-level implementation means that you're relying on something else to do the low-level implementation for you (such as DotNetWikiBot that RoBoT and HotnBOThered both use). With high-level implementations, you can use much simpler commands like Page.AddCategory "Male Users" without having to worry about how they work behind the scenes.
Since many low-level implementations aren't as full-featured as we might like them to be, programming a bot very often involves creating or modifying both a low-level implementation as well as a high-level one. In the case of RoBoT, I know rpeh's done a lot of modification to DotNetWikiBot. I've also done some, though as yet, I haven't needed to change as much as he has, since my bot simply doesn't do all that much at this point.
Anyway, I dunno if that made sense at all, but I tried my best. :) Robin Hoodtalk 22:31, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
Some sense. Also NepheleBot is using perl for its programs.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 22:45, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Oh by the way I put a question on Rhep's talk page before remembering the giant red notice at the top of it :D. Could you take a look at it please?--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 22:57, 29 September 2010 (UTC)

Thanks, I'd missed the note on NepheleBot's page that it was written in perl. I've also just replied to your note to rpeh. Robin Hoodtalk 23:52, 29 September 2010 (UTC)
What does : do? --Rigas Papadopoulos Talk 08:42, 2 October 2010 (UTC)
If you look at this section, or just about any other talk page, it should be pretty obvious. When you put it at the beginning of a line, it indents the text. The more of them you put, the more it indents. It's normal to add one more than the previous response on a talk page, unless it starts getting too indented. Robin Hoodtalk 09:44, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

Like the TES5 news section at the main page. Thanks, I get it and I will use it. --Rigas Papadopoulos Do you want anything? 10:01, 2 October 2010 (UTC)

A Cat....?[edit]

Hey RH! Since I'm in the mood for some serious investigation, I browsed through my sandboxes and found this cat. Now, I know he is harder than hell, but maybe you could tell me a bit about him? We know he travels to Leyawiin three times a month. But what about his life in the Imperial City? My schedule on the page is terribly wrong, so I would be glad if you could help me out. I don't really know where to start, but could you (for starters) take a look on his packages and see what we are up against? All the best - and thanks for the welcome back! --Krusty 19:47, 4 October 2010 (UTC)

Hello again. Just wanted to say that I moved the Ra'jiradh conversation to my personal talk page here, simply to avoid piling up my Sandbox talk page with valuable info. Oh, and I have posted the first question for you - no worries, it's a simple one; but they will get worse. Hope you are willing to help me out and have some fun with the cat - after all, you're the one with a cat on your userpage. --Krusty 09:42, 5 October 2010 (UTC)
A bit unrelated (but only a bit); I could really use an answer to my question here - I have tried to test it the hard way. If Hafid is dead, he will not take the trip. If both Wilbur and Sevarius Atius are dead he will not take the trip. I know there is an easier way than me testing this in all possible variations; namely you and your CS expertise. ;) Question is simple (and I assume the answer will be the same for all three cats); Who needs to be alive for them to take the trip? I hope you can help because I'm tired and need to sleep. --Krusty 22:37, 7 October 2010 (UTC)
Yup, I noticed it and it's on my list of things to look at. RC is being assaulted right now (in a good way!), so I'm working on those, but it's on my list of things to do to follow up on Ra'jiradh and Urjabhi, probably while you're asleep. :) Robin Hoodtalk 22:40, 7 October 2010 (UTC)
Let's see if I can answer this: Urjabhi needs Sevarius and Hafid, Hassiri needs just Wilbur, and Raj needs Witseidutsei to be alive. Is that all? :) --Arch-Mage Matt Did I Do That? 22:43, 7 October 2010 (UTC)
If both of you can agree on these "conditions", then they will go on the pages. Nighty night. --Krusty 22:47, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

() Okay and good morning. You should be good to go, like we discussed on the IRC. Oh, and this train is extremely cramped so feel free to change the wording if you get any ideas along the way. --Krusty 10:44, 8 October 2010 (UTC)

Fixed the wording, so now the page is 99% perfect, at least as far as I'm concerned - with the exception of that annoying Note... --Krusty 18:25, 8 October 2010 (UTC)


Could you take a look at User ESDate and see what I did wrong?--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 17:20, 5 October 2010 (UTC)

Now that I'm back, I'll get to this later today. Is it just the space between the message and the date that's the problem? Robin Hoodtalk 21:01, 7 October 2010 (UTC)
Never mind. Rpeh got it while you were away.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 21:36, 7 October 2010 (UTC)
Ah, yes, I see now. I've added a space to it, and I'll do the standardization thing and add a default image. It'll be saved in a few minutes. Robin Hoodtalk 21:53, 7 October 2010 (UTC)

Related Changes[edit]

That's weird, I hope you can explain it. I was at my User Page, I pressed related changes and one of the related changes was one that you've done at your User Page (smaller version of the same pic). What happened? --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 13:29, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

Related Changes is the same as Recent Changes, except that it's limited to pages that link to or from the page you're looking at. In other words, since you've linked both my page and rpeh's on your user page, you will see any changes to our user pages in Related Changes from your User page. If you look back at October 5, you'll see rpeh's last change to his page. Robin Hoodtalk 21:15, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
That sounds logical. Thanks! --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 05:06, 11 October 2010 (UTC)


I know I asked you to if you had all the info on TR3 creatures because you sent me an e-mail with that in it. But where did it go??? Also, on a related note I'm guessing the AI package means that Sea Crabs try to kill you, but Mole Crabs run away?--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 16:05, 10 October 2010 (UTC)

I can't help you with where the e-mail went, but yes, with the high Fight value, it doesn't take much to get a Sea Crab to fight you...just approaching them should do it. Whereas Molecrabs would be much more likely to flee than to fight. Compare the values (Sea Crab: 90 Fight, 20 Flee; Molecrab: 30 Fight, 80 Flee) with the ones here to get an idea. Robin Hoodtalk 21:58, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
Sorry about being unclear - I have the e-mail. I just can't find where I asked you if you knew these.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 22:08, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
That's a good question, let me see if I can find it. I know it must've been either something on my watchlist or as I was patrolling, cuz I don't normally pay much attention to TR3 stuff, though I've got the files for fact-checking and the like. ... Ah, there it is! You'd actually asked rpeh on his talk page, and if I recall, it was later at night when I spotted it, so I knew he'd've gone to bed by then, so I responded (but by e-mail cuz I didn't want to break my mini-wiki-break). Then he also responded (at least, I think it was a response to that) in a later section. Robin Hoodtalk 22:45, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
Oh. That explains why I couldn't find the section on your talk page.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 23:10, 10 October 2010 (UTC)
Speaking of these where can they (and the rest of the TR3 specific things) be found? How common are they? And I'll need the hostility for the rest of them as well. Sorry about bugging you - normally I'd just check the page but that doesn't work so well when you're writing it.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 20:08, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
I'll assume by "rest of the TR3 specific things" you mean the Beasts, and not every last item in TR3. ;) To avoid confusion, I used the editor ID names for everything, and it's all in the same order as on the Beasts page (though I made the table sortable in case some other order is useful for you). You may want to get rpeh or another TR3 type person to look this over, as I'm still fairly new to the Morrowind CS, and don't know my way around as much (not to mention, it's a featureless wonder in some ways). Given the number of entries, I'll save it in chunks as I get time to look at each entry.
Huge freakin' table
Creature Fight Flee Locations
TR_m1_Mating_Alit_Uni 30 0 Just the two in Boethian Mountains Region (31, 12)
TR_cr_cephalopod 90 30
  • Telvanni Mountains Region
  • Molagreahd Region
  • Boethian Mountains Region
  • Many others scattered around
TR_cr_cephalopod_dis 90 30 Unused
TR_cr_cephalopod_bigdis 90 20 Unused
TR_cr_cephalopod_big 90 20
  • 1 fixed in Telvan Grotto
  • Randomly in Molagreahd and Boethian Mountains Regions
TR_cr_sea_crab_dis 90 20
TR_cr_sea_crab 90 20
TR_cr_molecrab_diseased 30 80
TR_cr_molecrab 30 80
TR_m1_molecrab_s 30 80 5 at Sarvanni Molecrab Farm
TR_m1_molecrab_w 30 80
  • 8 at Sarvanni Molecrab Farm
  • 1 at Sarvanni, Ienit Cave Dwelling
  • 1 at Sarvanni, Sendala Cave Dwelling
TR_dreugh_dis 100 25
TR_M1_i42_Dreugh_Warlor 90 20 1 at Seradan Grotto (unique)
TR_cr_dridrea 90 0
TR_cr_dridrea_GREATER 90 0
TR_cr_dridrea_BOSS 90 0 Unused
TR_cr_dridrea_LESSER 90 0
TR_cr_eyestar_diseased 0 90 Unused
TR_cr_eyestar 0 90 Unused except as the soul for a Grand Soul Gem in Port Telvannis, Turosi Salvel: Enchanter
TR_slaughterfish_dis 100 0
TR_cr_barfish_1a 0 100
TR_cr_barfish_1b 0 100
TR_cr_barfish_1c 0 100
TR_cr_barfish_2a 0 100
TR_cr_barfish_2b 0 90
TR_cr_barfish_2c 0 90
TR_cr_barfish_3a 0 100
TR_cr_barfish_3b 0 100
TR_cr_barfish_3c 0 100
TR_kwama forager_dis
TR_m2_kwama queen_He
TR_m2_kwama queen_Kapid

() Creature locations involve leveled lists of leveled lists of leveled lists for some of these and just get way too complex. I'm afraid we'll have to come back to them later (if at all), perhaps in conjunction with creating Tes3Mod:Tamriel Rebuilt/Leveled Creature Lists. For now, I'm updating only the simple data; anything that involves a leveled list I'm leaving blank. Robin Hoodtalk 10:40, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

Agreed. Let's shelve those for now. I think that for the vermin a generic "these hostile creatures can be found in most cities where they are a nuisance but not in general dangerous". Also I've restarted the Hlidara Mothril investigation here.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 20:50, 15 October 2010 (UTC)
BTW, I haven't forgotten about this, it's just that every time I sit down to do some more entries, a hundred different things come up either on-site or off. I sat down to do some over an hour ago...and do you see any new entries here? Neither do I! I'll try again tomorrow, though, honest! Robin Hoodtalk 16:20, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

Per this[edit]

I'm thinking that's not supposed to happen. If a user wanted to edit their section, they couldn't because for some reason they are actually editing the template itself. That probably explains this mistaken edit a while back. Is there a way we can change the template so that if I were to edit my roleplaying section, I would just edit my section, and not get redirected to editing the template? Or would we have to tell users that the only way to edit a section is to edit the whole page? -- Jplatinum16 17:24, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

I'm not understanding what's happening. Where is it that they're clicking to cause the problem? I tried both page and section edits on Emperor Ray's page and both worked as expected. Robin Hoodtalk 20:47, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
Try going to my roleplaying ideas page and editing the scavenger section. You should get the template not the text.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 20:55, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
Okay, now that's screwey! D'oh! I need my coffee...just realized it didn't work on ER4's page cuz they weren't roleplaying templates! Let me play around and see if I can figure out a solution. Robin Hoodtalk 21:02, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
I found one ugly hack of a workaround that'll do for now (by virtue of getting rid of the section edit button altogether). I'll see if I can find something else after breakfast/coffee. ;) I'm not sure if we'll be able to fix it or not. Robin Hoodtalk 21:19, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
Hmm. Why doesn't that work for your RPs?--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 23:35, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
Because mine are using an experimental copy of the template as I try to see if I can find a better solution. Robin Hoodtalk 23:46, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
Just to follow-up on this, I've tried everything I can think of, and can't get a section to be included without either linking back to the original or not linking at all. I think the safest bet is to leave it as it is, with no linking at all. I'll look around WP and elsewhere to see if I can find any templates that use some kind of a trick for something like this, but it's rare to see headers in templates at all, and I'm thinking this is probably why. Robin Hoodtalk 00:04, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
What about doing {{Subst:RobinHood70/Archive2010/RoleplayingIdeas}} only modified so that what shows up is the source code when you edit instead of transcluding it onto the page when you view it? Is that even possible?--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 00:22, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

() I was wandering that possibility also, but I have no idea if it is possible. It's a real unfortunate problem, but I guess it's not the biggest thing (we could always warn users that they will have to edit their whole page instead of a section). Thanks for trying, but if you can find anything that might work, please do! -- Jplatinum16 00:27, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

Substituting would probably work, but I'm thinking the better solution would be to change the instructions and template so that the header is up to the user to create, and the template just adds the section to the correct categories. I'll bring it up at Oblivion talk:Roleplaying Ideas after lunch. Robin Hoodtalk 00:29, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
Just curious: what time is it where you live? Where I am, most people would be crashing in for the night. -- Jplatinum16 00:37, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict) Hmm. Is there someway to change the timezone my signature uses? I'd like people to know what time it actually is for me since right now it's early night for me but lunch for you. Not that it's a problem. I'm simply curious about this.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 00:41, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
The only thing I can think of is in your preferences, but I don't think that changes your signature or I would've expected at least a few people to be signing with non-UTC timestamps. As for my local time, it was early evening for me too (8:30pm) when I left for lunch...but I only got up at 4:30pm. It's one of the drawbacks of being housebound and having sleeping difficulties. I'm thinking at this point of deliberately pushing forward till I've wrapped around to a more normal schedule. I've done that a couple of times before, but it's usually a little unpleasant. Robin Hoodtalk 02:44, 12 October 2010 (UTC)

Non-existent Template?[edit]

Can you take a look at UESPWiki:Administrator Noticeboard/Archive 13#Block Appeal? I added the second one of these } but it says the page doesn't exist. Mostly what I want is to know is whether it's supposed to be an actual page and someone messed up, it's something that got deleted or it's something that doesn't actually exist and shouldn't.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 18:26, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

Just fixed it: it was a spelling error (Licence-> License). -- Jplatinum16 20:25, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

A Cat in the Brain[edit]

Hey, it’s me again – your favorite cat-obsessed editor with a whole bunch of new info that hopefully should help us solve the last pices of the mysterious PlayerNear-like behavior of the three Khajiits of the Black Horse Courier. I have now followed all three of them, and it seems like they all suffer from the same strange package that sends them back to the office in the Market District – just not when the player is near. What I hope for is that you can somehow compare the schedules, packages or whatever – and find out exactly what is going on here.

  • Ra'Jiradh: Will return to the Black Horse Courier on Thursdays, just not when you are in the Arboretum, where he will be wandering around. Strangely, he will ignore the players’ presence on Fredas and randomly run back from the Green Emperor Way, even if you are there with him.
  • Hassiri will do exactly the same thing when he is wandering around the Arboretum. This happens on Tirdas and follows the exact same pattern; he stays at the Arboretum if you are there – but will run back to the office if you are somewhere else.
  • Urjabhi most likely holds the key to figure it out; On Saturdays and Sundays, he will spend the afternoon, from 12pm until 6pm, inside The Bloated Float Inn on the Waterfront. Again, if you are there with him, he will simply stay. If you are anywhere else, he will occasionally rush back to the office. This surprised me quite a bit, but there HAVE to be some sort of connection between 3(!) NPCs, who all shows the same weird behavior.

Besides that little “problem” (and it should be mentioned on the respective pages as Notes), all three of them are all done and ready for launch, with both Ra'jiradh and Hassiri sitting in Sandboxes - and the Urjabhi-page launched, mistakenly without any Note for now, Hopefully, you can find the time (and the patience) to give these creatures one final investigation and, hopefully, figure out what is going on. --Krusty 22:25, 11 October 2010 (UTC)

Of course once the felines are taken care of we still have two Orcs and a human to take care of.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 23:14, 11 October 2010 (UTC)
Well, we're a little further along now. I was able to get Hassiri to do as you described, so I started looking into it. The others are all the same underlying problem. If you don't follow Hassiri, he never actually makes it to the Arboretum. Instead, he gets stuck in the Imperial Palace district, and then the second package in the list on Krusty's talk page kicks in (same package for Hassiri as for Ra'Jiradh), causing him to return to the BHC. What's odd about this is that that means he's seen as no longer being in the Imperial City at all! I'm damned if I can figure out what's going on more than that, though.
For the PC players among you, if you want to see what I mean, use TDT with SDT 0 or SDT 31 and click on Hassiri (or whichever brother you're interested in). You'll see that at the appropriate weekday and time, he starts pathing towards the Arboretum, then gets "stuck" in the ICImperialPalace world and stops pathing. Eventually, the ImpExReturn package kicks in and sends him back to the BHC. Any insights into this are welcome! Robin Hoodtalk 14:22, 12 October 2010 (UTC)
What are the cell names for the Market District, Green Emperor Way and The Bloated Float?--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 18:19, 13 October 2010 (UTC)
The Market District and Green Emperor Way are actually mini-worlds named ICMarketDistrict and ICImperialPalace. Cells underneath each are ICMarketDistrict01-04, ICPalace01-06, or Wilderness. It has occurred to me that it's possible that Hassiri is being seen as in a Wilderness cell and therefore no longer in an IC-named cell. It's something I'll have to see if I can check. I think if I just move straight to him, it might trigger a refresh of where everything is in the cell/world, so I may have to play for a bit to see what's doable. But continuing with your question, The Bloated Float's main cell, where Urjabhi wanders is ICWaterfrontTheBloatedFloat. Plus there's ICWaterfrontTheBloatedFloatLoadRoom (The Bloated Float Private Room) and ICWaterfrontTheBloatedFloatBelowDeck (The Bloated Float Inn Deck). Robin Hoodtalk 00:55, 14 October 2010 (UTC)
I don't see how they could be entering a Wilderness cell - especially Urjabhi - but otherwise that theory makes sense. There must be some AI package kicking in, and it must be a higher priority than the Arboretum / Bloated float packages, and the only one that fits the bill in all three cases is the ImpExReturn package that has "GetInCell IC == 0" as a condition. (Well okay, the MQ16 Martial Law package too, but then we'd see every single NPC heading home so I don't think it can be that one.) That must mean that for some reason, at some time, GetInCell is returning False when it should be returning True, although I have no idea why that would happen. It might be possible to get a list of NPCs who use that function, then we can see if it's a wider problem. rpeh •TCE 09:40, 14 October 2010 (UTC)
That sounds reasonable - at least the parts I can understand. I think I'll launch the pages later today, with a temporary note explaining what is going on - maybe even a VN-tag to make sure we don't forget to solve this problem. Nevertheless, a list of other infected NPCs will be very useful later on - so if that is possible, please extract. Thanks for looking into it! --Krusty 10:13, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

() There's no doubt it's the ImpExReturn package that's causing him to go to the BHC office — if you remove it, he stops returning. The larger issue, though, is that once Hassiri hits Green Emperor Way (ICImperialPalace world), he simply stops pathing to the Arboretum (use SDT 31 to see this). If you try GetInCell 2C80D (= IC) at that point, it returns 0, which is not what you'd expect. My guess is that it returns 0 because it sees him as "lost", but that's only a guess. As soon as you enter Green Emperor Way yourself, he continues on normally and re-targets the Arboretum (unless he's already switched to ImpExReturn), but if you leave GEW before he does, he stops pathing again. I've tried several things, and invariably, pathing fails there. Robin Hoodtalk 12:23, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

I have now launched all three pages with a Notes section and a VN-tag describing the problem - but not explaining it. --Krusty 08:01, 15 October 2010 (UTC)
Something just occurred to me; we never actually did any testing on this weird condition in Ra'jiradh travel package. No worries, I'll test it - but I have one question: Do the other two Khajiits have similar travel conditions? --Krusty 21:05, 31 October 2010 (UTC)
The only thing I can think of is that it was meant to create a schedule where only one messenger would be out at a time, but the conditions are backwards for that, so I'm far from certain that that was the intent. Here are the conditions for the equivalent packages in each (repeating Ra'jiradh's so they're all in one place):
  • Hassiri: Wilbur has never died, in the BHC office, neither Urjabhi or Ra'jiradh are there, and it's the 1st, 10th, or 20th of the month.
  • Ra'jiradh: Witseidutsei has never died, in the BHC office, Urjabhi's not there, and it's the 4th, 13th, or 23rd of the month.
  • Urjabhi: Neither Wilbur nor Severius Atius have ever died, in the BHC, and it's the 7th, 16th, or 26th or the month. (No requirements that anybody else not be there on this package.) Robin Hoodtalk 21:43, 31 October 2010 (UTC)
Brilliant! Thank you for the quick reply. I'll do some checking - but I seriously believe that both Hassiri and Ra'jiradh will take off no matter what. We'll see. :) --Krusty 21:47, 31 October 2010 (UTC)
F-word. Just took a look at Ra'jiradh on the 23rd, at 4pm - in the BHC office and with Urjabhi present. Ra'jiradh did NOT travel to Leyawiin, but kept wandering around. Seems like the conditions must be met after all. Curses. How to describe that "detail" in his schedule? --Krusty 19:12, 1 November 2010 (UTC)

9000 edits!!![edit]

You reached 9000 edits! Congratulations! --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 10:58, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Oh, I hadn't noticed that. Thanks! (Although I suppose I really reached 9000 a little while ago, since I also had another account for a while.) Robin Hoodtalk 11:20, 13 October 2010 (UTC)
You're welcome. By the way, I know about Joram, you mentioned it at Nephele's talk page. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 11:31, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

Can You Fix Some Formatting For Me?[edit]

I'm trying to get vertical text on either side of a message here. The problem is it keeps messing up no matter what I try. Any ideas?--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 22:03, 13 October 2010 (UTC)

You have several options:
  • Use <br>'s at the end of each line, and <tt></tt> tags around the whole thing.
  • Use <pre></pre> tags around the whole thing.
  • Use the {{Pre}} template with <nowiki></nowiki> tags around the entire text. This has the advantage of allowing some extra formatting and/or automatic width (e.g. {{Pre|width=auto|<nowiki>W This story... ...|||G</nowiki>}} would give:
W This story...
  • Use a table, like this:
This story takes liberties with Lore in his stories W
Robin Hoodtalk 01:15, 14 October 2010 (UTC)


Since you are online right now (I watch Recent Changes), can you help me add link from our Wikipedia article at the appropriate pages (mostly users)? I do not know how. The link is --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 12:34, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, I can't right now, I've got a back-dated project for TAO that I'm about to start working on. If it's mostly users, just cut & paste the first part of the should go pretty quickly. Robin Hoodtalk 12:55, 14 October 2010 (UTC)
What do you mean by "first part of a link"? --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 12:58, 14 October 2010 (UTC)
Paste [ in front of each name, then you just have to do the rest of it. Robin Hoodtalk 13:01, 14 October 2010 (UTC)
Thanks! --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 13:04, 14 October 2010 (UTC)
Unfortunately, I can not do it. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 13:08, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

Help (again)[edit]

Since you are very experienced editor, can you create an automatic calculating system here? I realize that I may be asking too much (especially with CFS) but no pressure, if you can't I will ask rpeh. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 15:53, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

I don't see any way of doing that. Wikis just weren't designed for that sort of thing. Robin Hoodtalk 16:51, 15 October 2010 (UTC)
Krusty suggested it and it seems possible after taking a look at . If you can't it doesn't matter a lot, I just thought that the page will be better with an automatic calculating system. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 19:45, 15 October 2010 (UTC)
That involves server-side scripting, which I have no experience with...only a couple of people here do, and none of them are currently very active. Just to demonstrate the difference, though, have a look at the "real" wiki version of the same page. It's an interesting idea, and I can see users possibly posting scores from it much like they already post stats from the Active Users page, but I don't think we can automate it without help. Robin Hoodtalk 03:33, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
Can you think of anybody that can do it? --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 07:04, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
As I said, none of the people that I know who have the skill are currently active, so I think it'll have to be manual for now. Robin Hoodtalk 07:09, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
Okay. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 07:20, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Hlidara's AI[edit]

Could you provide an AI table for Hlidara please? I've noticed that things tend to be much easier when there's one of those.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 22:00, 15 October 2010 (UTC)

You sure it is necessary with an entire table filled with Accompany-packages? I mean, we have nailed 90% of her schedule and a few tests will probably provide the rest of the answers. Biggest problem I can think of is that whole mounting-her-horse thing when she goes to Chorrol with the Countess - that problem should be mentioned on both Hlidara and Alessia's pages and I have no idea what to write in a note. But a note should be written, without a doubt. --Krusty 22:09, 15 October 2010 (UTC)
I was just thinking how much easier I find it to spot conflicting packages if I have a table to look at.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 22:33, 15 October 2010 (UTC)
Date/Time Activity Notes
Midnight-7am Sleep in Chorrol Castle Private Quarters Only if Hlidara's in Chorrol
Any Accompany Alessia Caro Only if Alessia's in Chorrol
15th of any month, 3pm-9pm Accompany Alessia Caro (no matter where anybody is) Only if Ahdarji's Heirloom isn't running; can use a horse
8pm-11pm Eat, sitting on chair to Alessia's right in Leyawiin Castle County Hall Only if Hlidara's in Leyawiin already and the dinner party isn't occurring
Any Accompany Alessia Caro Any time Allesia's outside of either Leyawiin or Chorrol; can use a horse
Midnight-6am Sleep in Leyawiin Castle Private Quarters (No conditions on this; relies on failure of conditions of higher packages)
Any Accompany Alessia Caro Only if Alessia is in Leyawiin
Note that some of the location conditions are dependent on Hlidara's location; others are dependent on Alessia's. I've noted each specifically. The gist of her AI, at least at a quick look, seems to be: accompany Alessia Caro everywhere except when eating or sleeping. Robin Hoodtalk 04:06, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
Thanks, RH70 - not really surprising that almost all the packages involve Alessia's whereabouts, but still a useful table due to the many small twists in her AI. One question I can't figure out from the table; if you take a look at TAO's sandbox, you will notice a strange Bug Note about Hlidara crashing the Countess' dinner party during Sanguine. I'm not sure I understand exactly what is going on from the explanation - maybe you could double-check, just to make sure? Thanks again! --Krusty 16:16, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
I saw that problem, both when typing up the AI and later when I was browsing the sandbox. What happens is that all the first six packages fail since they're not in Chorrol, the dinner party is occurring (it's actually either Stage 20 or Stage 25), and Alessia is in Leyawiin. So the bottom package is the one that takes effect, and Hlidara accompanies Alessia, but doesn't eat. Since Alessia is eating, Hlidara just stands around nearby. Robin Hoodtalk 16:54, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

() Ah! That makes much better sense - I think I can reword the bug and make it slightly more understandable based on that explanation. Thanks! --Krusty 16:57, 16 October 2010 (UTC)

Ack! I was pretty sure I understood what you meant, but then I re-read the bug note and it says (written by S'drassa btw): Also, if the Countess happens to run into a bug that causes to permanently be stuck in her chair, she will simply stare at her after 11pm and until 12am, when her ordinary sleeping package starts. Where does THAT fit into the table and your explanation? --Krusty 20:22, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
Me again - for the third time; and no worries, I tested Hlidara during Sanguine, with and without the "staying-at-the-dinnertable"-Alessia-bug you trigger by following her into her bedroom while she is naked.. Hlidara will simply stand by her side all day long, from 6am 'till midnight, even when Alessia hits the bug and eats 24 hours a day. This basically means that all her packages (except the sleeping packages) are canceled the moment Alessia sits down at the table. --Krusty 20:59, 16 October 2010 (UTC)
Basically, packages are always evaluated top to bottom, with the first one whose conditions are satisfied "winning". So if Alessia is stuck in her chair in Leyawiin, then only the 15th, Eat, Sleep, and bottom-most Accompany packages have conditions that can be satisfied. So from 8pm-11pm, Hlidara will eat; from midnight to 6am, she'll sleep; otherwise, she'll follow Alessia which, since Alessia's stuck, means that Hlidara will just sit/stand there the whole time until the Eat/Sleep packages kick in again. Does that make sense?
Yep, at least I think so; her page is now up and running - it took a lot more testing than expected, but it should be complete now. Feel free to reword the schedule, bugs and notes if you see anything wrong with them - and thanks again for helping out! --Krusty 09:07, 17 October 2010 (UTC)


Why you are ashamed to admit that you spent time on the UESPholic test? :) If you had fun, you should not. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 09:25, 16 October 2010 (UTC) P.S. Congratulations for your score!

New Rights[edit]

Daveh just made you a Chartographer and a Map User. Congratulations! --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 19:17, 17 October 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. Robin Hoodtalk 03:08, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

Journey to Aetherius[edit]

Hey Rob! I think Daggerfall:Journey to Aetherius almost hits FA-status, so I decided to put in some effort to make it perfect. However, and probably due to the still-ongoing DF Redesign Project, I ran into a couple of problems along the way, specifically with the Linkable Entries to the Bestiary. Example given; is it possible to link to the Gargoyle? Or the Harpy? And if yes, how? Also, the Magic and Spells-page seems to have no linkable entries whatsoever, which would be very useful to have - problem is, I'm unsure how to add them. Thanks in advance! --Krusty 07:31, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

The ones that have linkable entries, you just treat them like subsections on a page, so: Gargoyle, Harpy. To add new linkable entries, you just add {{Linkable Entry|original term}} around the original term. If the term is itself a link, put the LE tag inside the link (see what I did with Alteration on the Magic and Spells page). Robin Hoodtalk 07:40, 18 October 2010 (UTC)
Hmm, that was pretty easy - I could have sworn the linkable entries didn't work, but they do. I'll change all the links from Lore to DF. Thanks! --Krusty 07:45, 18 October 2010 (UTC)

Broken Link[edit]

After you reverted my edit at Shivering:Heretic you used a broken link at your edit summary. What was the page that you intended to link to? --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 12:29, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, it should have been: Wikipedia:English_articles#Discrimination_between_a_and_an. Robin Hoodtalk 12:32, 19 October 2010 (UTC)

Copying the VN Template?[edit]

I'm currently doing work on a fallout wiki and need to put VN tags. However they don't have the template - would copying ours over cause trouble? Also would it be legal under our current license?--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 07:08, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

It'd need one small change in the "see talk page" part to avoid having to copy the {{Pl}} template as well (which would need some conversion, since it uses Metatemplate).
<includeonly><sup>[''verification needed — {{{1|see <span class="plainlinks">[{{fullurl:{{TALKPAGENAME}}}} talk page]</span>}}}'']</sup>{{#switch:{{SUBJECTSPACE}}|Category|Template|User=|[[Category:All Pages Needing Verification]][[Category:{{NS_NAME}} Pages Needing Verification]]}}</includeonly><noinclude>{{/Doc}}</noinclude>
I see no licensing issues at all, since it's a very generic template, and I'm pretty sure the original version was based on one of several similar WP templates. Robin Hoodtalk 07:17, 20 October 2010 (UTC)
Thanks! I just wanted to make sure of that before I did it. I'm gonna go ahead and bring it over now.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 07:23, 20 October 2010 (UTC)
Vashiden! They already have it under Verify. I forgot to include the namespace before. (Note: Vashiden is a Qunari curse in case you don't recognize it).--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 07:26, 20 October 2010 (UTC)
In order to recognize it, or to know what Qunari are, I'm guessing I would first have to have played Dragon Age. :) As for the template name, maybe for my next template project, I'll undertake to rename all templates consistently across all wikis everywhere! ... Errrrm ... okay, maybe not. Robin Hoodtalk 07:32, 20 October 2010 (UTC)
(edit conflict) Sorry about spamming your talk page - I'm going to copy it anyway because the current template is pretty well useless. All it has is a timestamp option; anything else (like "conflicting information" or "see talk") returns: Expression error: Unexpected < operator.
(Composed after EC) Yeah, but at least then you only have to ask one question - rather than what language is it in you only have to ask what Qunari is. Also you could have played Dragon Age and not recognize it. If you didn't pay attention to what Sten says when you take him out of the party or you either never included him in the first place or remove him if you did.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 07:40, 20 October 2010 (UTC)

Bot (again)[edit]

What happened to your bot? --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 15:12, 23 October 2010 (UTC) got busy? I'm not sure what you mean. Robin Hoodtalk 15:16, 23 October 2010 (UTC)
I mean that out of nowhere, it suddenly made about 900 edits. --Rigas Papadopoulos • Talk to meMy work 15:17, 23 October 2010 (UTC)
We discussed it here and agreed that because it was a fairly simple change, even if it affects a lot of pages, it would be a good first editing task for HotnBOThered, rather than getting RoBoT to do it. Robin Hoodtalk 15:21, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Omnomnom :)[edit]

Choco chip cookie.png
You have been given a cookie!

Your dedication and diligence to the wiki has not gone unnoticed. A user has seen the progress you've made, and has given you a cookie because of it. Good work! The user had the following to say:

Lucil Hellsing 16:57, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Thanks for the speedy response with Argonian Boy.

I think you meant Rigas, but you're welcome one way or the other. :) Robin Hoodtalk 18:49, 23 October 2010 (UTC)
If you mean the answer at the Oblivion Talk:Merchants, it was me. What confused you? --Rigas Papadopoulos • TalkDeeds 18:53, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

Fighter's Guild Porters[edit]

I don't know if this applies on the PC, but on the xbox once you join the guild, porters will start following you. I don't know if it's in all cities, but I know it happens in Anvil and Chorrol. -- Jplatinum16 23:27, 23 October 2010 (UTC)

I checked in Skingrad and in the Construction Set, but I wasn't a member of the guild. I'll load a different game where the character is a member of the guild and check in Anvil and Chorrol. I'll report back shortly and if we need to, we can modify the page from there. I'm planning on doing a bunch more editing to it anyway, to make it look more like Dark Brotherhood Murderers. I think what's there now could use a bit of an overhaul. Somehow that page seems to have been missed on a large number of things, like the Trail template, the OBNPCRP tag, NPC Summaries, etc. Robin Hoodtalk 23:53, 23 October 2010 (UTC)
Interesting. Now that I look more closely, I see what's happening, though I can only speculate as to why they've done it that way. It looks like they've got the same "Continue if PC Near" that's normally used for store-owners to keep them from closing up shop while you're still inside. It also means that they'll always keep you in sight if possible. However, that only occurs if you're a member of the Fighter's Guild, and only if it's between 6am and midnight (or, I think, if it was whenever they last spotted you). If you leave the guild and re-enter between midnight and 6am, the porter will wander randomly. My suspicion is that this was a change in thinking and that they weren't supposed to offer services at night originally. Then when they changed it, they forgot to remove the PC Near flag. Robin Hoodtalk 00:08, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
Weird how it works out like that (and even weirder that this wasn't documented before). I've always wondered why they've followed me around for no apparent reason. -- Jplatinum16 00:17, 24 October 2010 (UTC)
I misspoke slightly: the following occurs whether or not you're in the guild, but it's still time-dependent. Robin Hoodtalk 01:03, 24 October 2010 (UTC)

Bot (yet again)[edit]

Your bot reached 1000 edits. Congratulations! --Rigas Papadopoulos • TalkDeeds 15:26, 25 October 2010 (UTC)


Thanks for this! It's getting a bit popular. --Rigas Papadopoulos • TalkDeeds 16:25, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

No problem. If you want, you can replace the "Example" with so people can use your userbox like this: {{User:Rigas Papadopoulos/UESPholic Userbox|1234}} rather than copying the whole thing to their page, but that's up to you. Robin Hoodtalk 19:00, 25 October 2010 (UTC)
That sounds better. I am going to do it. Thanks again. --Rigas Papadopoulos • TalkDeeds 19:22, 25 October 2010 (UTC)
Can you do it for me? I am experiencing technical problems. --Rigas Papadopoulos • TalkDeeds 19:36, 25 October 2010 (UTC)
Done. I also changed the one on your user page to show how to use it. There's actually a shorter way to type it, but it would only work for you, so I used the "long form", which'll work for anybody who copies the box from your page. Robin Hoodtalk 19:56, 25 October 2010 (UTC)
Thank you very much, I'm really grateful! --Rigas Papadopoulos • TalkDeeds 19:59, 25 October 2010 (UTC)
No problem. Robin Hoodtalk 20:01, 25 October 2010 (UTC)

Quest Header Parms?[edit]

I think that was supposed to be Params right? If not what's a Parm?--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 20:42, 26 October 2010 (UTC)

"Param" is the more common short-form of "parameters", but some people use "Parm" instead. (Try googling programming "parm" and you'll see numerous occurrences.) We're definitely in the minority, but I picked it up somewhere when I was first learning programming and still use it more often than not. Lately, though, I sometimes use "param" since it's the more common short-form. There's no rhyme or reason to it at this point, though, just whichever one I feel like using that day. ;) Robin Hoodtalk 20:59, 26 October 2010 (UTC)
Ah... I didn't know that. Thanks for clarifying!--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 21:04, 26 October 2010 (UTC)


Can you help me? I have a userbox at my page that says I am an auto-confirmed user. The problem is, the background is orange. I can't remember where the color codes are so can you help me? I want it to be beige (if I spelled it correctly), much like the background of our Wiki's pages. --Rigas Papadopoulos • TalkDeeds 19:55, 28 October 2010 (UTC)

I have several color codes in my sandbox. You can refer to it when you need codes, or feel free to save it in your own if you think you'd have a hard time remembering where it is. --GKtalk2me 22:33, 28 October 2010 (UTC)
Mine's better! Also, Rigas, if you're confused about which parameter to change, it's the id-c (ID color) parameter that you want to change. Robin Hoodtalk 23:49, 28 October 2010 (UTC)
You know, I thought about this before but never remembered to mention it... Should we possibly make a UESPWiki:Userboxes/Color Codes? It would probably help some people. --GKtalk2me 02:00, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
I'd also thought at one point that we might want to make a Color Codes page, but like you, lost track of the idea. I hadn't thought to put it as a subpage of Userboxes, though that makes a lot of sense. If you want to use mine, go nuts, though there's a sort-of redundant column there, cuz I wanted to make sure that the colour numbers and text colours matched in all browsers (which they do, as far as I can tell). Robin Hoodtalk 03:21, 29 October 2010 (UTC)
Thanks to both of you for the info. I changed the userbox to the color I wanted. A Color Codes page sounds good, it will make things much easier for newbies. --Rigas Papadopoulos • TalkDeeds 05:10, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

If you are online...[edit]

Check the Recent Changes. Someone has been creating sockpuppets (or at least it seems so). --Rigas Papadopoulos • TalkDeeds 19:55, 29 October 2010 (UTC)

Sorry, I've been busy with a personal project, so I didn't notice until now. I'm not sure what the best approach is here. I think the best thing to do is take it to the Admin Noticeboard (which I'll do in a sec). Robin Hoodtalk 04:00, 30 October 2010 (UTC)


Gold Star (special).jpg
You have been given a Gold Star!

Reviewing RPs[edit]

Hey RH! The Userification system for roleplays has reached the three month mark and is up for review. Your contributions to the discussion were prolific and relevant, so you should have a chance to take a look at this, if it isn't on your watchlist, especially considering the fact that you're on wiki-break and aren't checking here as often.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 17:21, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

Thanks. My Watchlist basically exploded in the last 12 hours or so, mostly with user talk-page edits for the various prominent users from the looks of it. It's all but hidden in amongst those, but I do see the Subjective Content page in my list, so I'll respond to it when I catch up with whatever's gotten everybody talking all at once. :) Robin Hoodtalk 22:30, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
That might have been me... I notified GK, Ninja Hinder, AMM, Krusty, Rpeh, JPlatinum16, and Michealdsuarez.--Ghurhak gro-Demril or TAOYes? 22:43, 9 December 2010 (UTC)
So far, it's mostly been Krusty and rpeh discussing the OPRP and some of the bot changes made as a result, but I see some changes on Brf's page, and I think there were some on yours too...don't remember right now. Robin Hoodtalk 22:45, 9 December 2010 (UTC)

Minor Bot Problem[edit]

It looks like HnB hit a glitch with some of the less regular quest headers. See this for what I mean. It shouldn't be a problem as we're checking all the MW/TR/BM quests by hand for other stuff at the moment and I don't think there are any affected Oblivion quests (I checked the ones I thought might be affected). Obviously it's not that important but I thought I should mention it for next time. rpeh •TCE 18:36, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

How odd! I'm not sure what would have caused that. I'm just taking the dog out for a walk, but I'll have a peek at it later today and see if I can figure out what caused it and if anything else would have been affected. Robin Hoodtalk 19:45, 13 December 2010 (UTC)
Bah! Stupid UltraEdit paste bug (at least in older versions) converted all the Unicode characters from this page to funky question marks. Looking quickly, I found three others, which have all been fixed since then. I'll look more thoroughly later. Robin Hoodtalk 20:08, 13 December 2010 (UTC)

Let's Chain[edit]

Hey since you seemed interesed in spell chaining, you might like this User:Wizy/Chain Spells.
Still needs a proper explanation, easier to understand, I'd like your opinion. --Wizy (Talk/Contribs) 01:22, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

I'll have a look at it later tonight, though I'm not sure how much I'll be able to help as I just installed Windows 7 a few days ago and wasn't planning on reinstalling Oblivion right away. Robin Hoodtalk 01:30, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Broken Link[edit]

The link on your userpage to wikipedia:Chronic Fatigue Syndrome should be [[wikipedia:chronic fatigue syndrome Chronic Fatigue Syndrome]], not [[wikipedia:Wikipedia:Chronic Fatigue Syndrome]]. -Zyrath 04:38, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

You're right (more or forgot the pipe in yours ;) ). Most often, we're linking to informational articles on wiki policy and I guess I just did that out of habit. Thanks for the spot! I'm surprised nobody's mentioned it before now. Robin Hoodtalk 04:44, 17 December 2010 (UTC)

Category Deletion[edit]

Hello RobinHood! I wanted to explain one of my recent actions as I'm sure it will cause something of a furor. I recently created a Christians Userbox and user category page in response to the Atheists one that has been there for some time. You proposed deleting the category because it is not pertinent to the site.

I agree that this is not pertinent, and am fine with its deletion, but only if the Atheists pages get the same treatment. Either they both need to stay, or they both need to go. Let me know what you'd like to do... BFG 00:43, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

And please note I was not trying to (as they say in the US) raise a stink about this. I saw there was an Atheists category but nothing for me, and so created it. I figured since one category was allowed to stay, this new one would be too.

No worries. I was worried that my deletion might be taken the wrong way, but wasn't sure how to address it exactly. Apparently, that's no longer an issue as it's now come up in a few places (see the Community Portal post). You're absolutely right that the Atheists category should go as well - I'd forgotten we had that. But even if we hadn't had an Atheists category, your creating a Christians category would have been perfectly understandable, as many of our userboxes create categories. The last I heard, the general consensus was that people were in favour of removing some of the existing ones, and that new ones shouldn't be created, so that's all I was really doing. Robin Hoodtalk 01:00, 20 December 2010 (UTC)
Oh! Well that makes sense, and thanks for pointing me to that Community Portal post. In light of the fact the site is wanting to avoid creating new categories, and likely will end up deleting a few exiting categories (including the Atheists one), then I agree with your decision. You'll have to undo the "undos" I just committed though.  :) Thanks, BFG 01:04, 20 December 2010 (UTC)

Re: Fortify Fatigue[edit]

Hey, no problem. It would probably help if I'd quit forgetting to give an Edit Summary to 'splain what I've done :) 06:57, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Another solution would be to create an account so we know it's you! :) Robin Hoodtalk 08:44, 21 December 2010 (UTC)

Christmas Challenge![edit]

Hey Rob! I just ran into a problem - again. I figured I'd throw the problem your way, simply because it's christmas. The problem is described in-depth here and, like I mentioned on the page, it seems like we have incorrect info all over the place. I hope you have the time to look into this; otherwise just let me know. Merry.... gah, I can't say it! --Krusty 20:10, 22 December 2010 (UTC)

I don't even have Oblivion installed right now (ever since doing a clean install of Windows 7). I'm not planning on reinstalling it in the immediate future, though I probably will whenever I become more active again. Robin Hoodtalk 22:35, 22 December 2010 (UTC)