User talk:Krusty/Arc 2013a

Climb the Steps

Hello there. Here is the image: File:SR-quest-Climb the Steps 02.jpg. (uncategorized; seems like the hotcat option is gone or I'm just blind) --Roger (talk) 22:58, 27 January 2013 (GMT)

Hm yeah, gadgets are currently unavailable. As workaround, they still work on content3.uesp.net. --Alfwyn (talk) 23:08, 27 January 2013 (GMT)

Thank you so much, Roger - I added it to the quest page, along with the dialogue. --Krusty (talk) 23:43, 27 January 2013 (GMT)

Image Request: Argonian (NPC)

Skyrim:Argonian (NPC)
I found one of the female dead Argonians and took a good screencap of it and is now up on its page but I can't find the male. The descriptive text says its NE of Shadowgreen Cavern but that is very north on the wintery shores. The link to the map shows its somewhere east of Gjukar's Monument and north of Fort Sungard but I can't seem to find it in either place. Is there any way to get me a better idea of where it is? - Snowolf69 (talk)

Use the Ref ID to move yourself to it ~ Dwarfmp (talk) 00:09, 29 January 2013 (GMT)

*Request Filled*: please post image in article. - Snowolf69 (talk) 17:13, 30 January 2013 (GMT)

Thanks a lot, Snowolf69! :) --Krusty (talk) 17:26, 30 January 2013 (GMT)

Could you please edit the caption to the dead argonian male to be the same as the dead argonian female just for my O.C.D.'s sake. :P - Snowolf69 (talk) 20:36, 30 January 2013 (GMT)

Elder Scroll image

I just wanted to let you know that it's difficult to get a good shot, invisibility works a bit too well, since the scroll becomes invisible too. I will tell you the details and possibilities later, I'm too tired right now and I'm off to bed ~ Dwarfmp (talk) 14:41, 29 January 2013 (GMT)

We found a way, I think. Check this out. --Krusty (talk) 23:21, 29 January 2013 (GMT)

Ah, small, but this is good for a detailed shot on the scroll. However it is not a good one for a situational shot, if you know what I mean. I'll talk to you in the chat when you get on ~ Dwarfmp (talk) 05:45, 30 January 2013 (GMT)

Thanks

Krusty, thanks for the admin stuff that you do. Thanks to all our current admins for everything lately. --JR (talk) 08:28, 30 January 2013 (GMT)

Happy (belated) Wikiversary!

You have been given a gold star! Your obsession has gone on for 4 years now. Here's to another 4 years of forced labor and being mentally held hostage by your crippling UESPholism! • JAT 07:00, 15 February 2013 (GMT)

The fact that you are this active on the site after so long simply astounds me. I'm am impressed by your dedication (sounds much better than "obsession"). --Xyzzy ^Talk 07:19, 15 February 2013 (GMT)

I'm actually coming at it from the opposite side. Has it only been four years? I thought you'd joined closer to when I did than that. What can I say? I can't remember what happened yesterday, much less years ago. :) Happy wikiversary! – Robin Hood  ^(talk) 07:22, 15 February 2013 (GMT)

I almost forgot to thank you people for the shiny star and wiki-versary greetings! Thanks! :) --Krusty (talk) 23:41, 17 February 2013 (GMT)

Ahtar - Bjartur scenes

I'm afraid these scenes are actually unused, mainly for the reason that both scenes of the quests DialogueSolitudeJailerScene1 and DialogueSolitudeJailerScene2 have "Begin on quest start" and "Stop quest on end" unchecked. (The quest nodes in "Actor Dialogue Event" start the scene quests based on certain conditions.) Also, the conditions indicate that these scenes should only happen in Castle Dour itself (and the tower), but not in the jail. I was able to create a fix, but I think taking a picture (for your request) is useless as the vanilla game doesn't feature this. --Roger (talk) 13:05, 16 February 2013 (GMT)

Hey Roger! Thanks for the notification - I'll remove the image request and put the unused dialogue in some notes sections on the NPC pages. :) --Krusty (talk) 18:40, 16 February 2013 (GMT)

Chezburgar's Nomination

Krusty, I'm not sure what else is going on in your life that might have contributed to your conduct on Chezburgar's nomination, but it's clear I'm not the only one who found your behavior both shocking and disappointing.

Oh no, this is the same old song once again. You people need to recognize a good editor when you see one, instead of always focusing on all that grammar/spelling bull. Chez has impressed me thoroughly in the past couple of months and has single-handedly created nearly all articles for creatures we have in the SR name-spae (yep, a spelling error right there!). All Chez needs to do is to promise everybody to make someone proofread his articles before launch, because honestly – it’s NOT about spelling and/or grammar anymore, it’s about knowledge on the ES games, especially the new ones. Add to all that that he is a really nice guy and incredibly mature for his age, I wholeheartedly support this nomination. And I will support it again when you people nominate him again in 2 months because he has “improved so much”. Please let’s think content and community, not all the other crap.

I can only hope that this post was intended to be supportive of Chezburgar, but you came across as rude, condescending, and extremely frustrated with other users' inability to see things as you do. The rest of the community clearly does recognize that Chezburgar is a good editor, since almost every single person who voted in that nomination said so. I won't go into "all that grammar/spelling bull," since it was addressed during the nomination, but your tone throughout the post is sarcastic and thoroughly disdainful of not only other editors' opinions, but the hard work they put in to help improve UESPWiki's pages in whatever way they can. You call grammar and spelling "bull" and "crap," and even throw a deliberate error in your post as if to provoke those who believe impeccable presentation is as vital to this wiki's pages as its content. You can disagree with those who believe grammar and style are important as much as you want, but there's absolutely no call to treat any user like that, no matter how much you may disagree.

Your second comment continues the trend of disrespect:

Comment: Ratwar, that grammar lesson is the most unnecessary and ridiculous thing I’ve seen on the wiki in several years. Please get out of 2008 and into the present. That goes for you too, Elliot. I know you hate the wiki and everything it stands for (the articles, the users, the layout), as you don’t even attempt to hide your hatred anymore. The two of you put together has made a total of 13 edits in all of 2013. What are you even doing in this nomination? Please stay away, especially if you don’t have anything intelligent to say.

While it may have been overkill for Ratwar to point out every single mistake on Chezburgar's user page, Ratwar has a right to his opinion like everyone else, and he even recognized himself that the post was probably a bit much and at least tried to express his opinion respectfully. In the above comment, you not only belittle another administrator's attempt to justify his vote, but go on to tell him to leave, as if his vote is insignificant to the community (and even a waste of the community's time) simply because he's been inactive lately. You show the same attitude toward Elliot; I would agree that it looks like Elliot lost his temper with you, but like it or not he is currently a member of the UESPWiki community and has the same right to participate in its decisions as everyone else. Accusing him of hating the wiki and "everything it stands for" is unproductive, rude, and completely unjustified. You implied that Elliot and Ratwar both "don't have anything intelligent to say," which is honestly nothing short of a personal attack. You acted as if they were not only wasting your time by taking the time to vote, but were too stupid to realize they shouldn't bother voting.

The behavior you demonstrated in this discussion is not acceptable for any user, much less an administrator who is expected to be a model of behavior for others in the community. As a leader in this community you should set an example by treating others with respect and keeping a cool head when disagreements arise. You could have simply supported Chezburgar's nomination, praised his attitude and contributions, and requested he have someone proofread his sandboxes before he makes large-scale changes. Instead, you insulted and belittled other members of the community, showing not only a lack of etiquette but also failing to assume good faith on the part of Ratwar, Elliot, and every other editor who was just trying to vote fairly and honestly, despite disagreeing with you. Every member of this community is valuable, "regardless of their edit count, administrative status, or time spent here," and yet you basically insisted that Ratwar and Elliot had no right to vote because of their inactivity over the last year and dismissed them out of hand.

Unfortunately, this is not the first time you've let your temper get the best of you. Your contribution to RobinHood70's RfA displayed the same negative, condescending attitude, and you've had issues in the IRC channel as well. In the last year you've also attacked other users and dismissed others' concerns by deleting their posts on the Administrator noticeboard. In any situation, it doesn't matter how heated the discussion was, and it doesn't matter if others are also guilty of personal attacks or treating editors disrespectfully; all users (especially administrators) should treat others with respect, all users are expected to contribute to community discussions with a clear, level head, and personal attacks are never acceptable.

You've always been a valuable member of this community and these displays of clear frustration from you have been infrequent, but this isn't a one-time incident, and it's always damaging to the community when someone so highly esteemed in our community behaves like that. Everyone gets stressed out and frustrated from time to time, but this behavior is not okay, and I hope a few deep breaths or perhaps a short wikibreak will prevent your frustration from getting the better of you in the future. ⇠eshe^talk 14:03, 4 March 2013 (GMT)

Gratian Caerellius

Hey Krusty. I noticed you uploaded a 4:3 version of Gratian Caerellius. I still have the original uncropped image with a higher resolution, but I noticed you've done some touching up to it. Do you want me to send you the original image? —Legoless (talk) 22:01, 11 March 2013 (GMT)

Definitely. I made the 4:3 version to get an indication on the layout of the upcoming article (with a plan on requesting a bigger image later), but if you still have the high-res version, I would appreciate it through e-mail, if possible. Thanks! :) --Krusty (talk) 22:06, 11 March 2013 (GMT)

Sent. —Legoless (talk) 23:19, 11 March 2013 (GMT)

Varona Nelas sandbox

Hi Krusty. I noticed the Varona Nelas sandbox conversations you added are in the game data. I tried a while back to witness some of these convos myself, but every time I stalk the poor woman, she never seems to speak with Neloth or the other workers.

After her initial talk with Talvas outside, she walks to her (locked) home and seemingly stays there until her demise during Reluctant Steward. Entering her house counts as trespassing and she gets angry. I have tried waiting around Neloth and not accepting a single quest from him, so I might catch her, and I'm almost certain she never comes to speak to him - despite the dialogue in the game data. Could it be that her package is completely messed up and she never actually leaves her home? --Jimeee (talk) 00:01, 1 April 2013 (GMT)

Hey Jimee! Yeah, we (Roger and I) did an awful lot of testing last night - and I wrote most of our discoveries down in the Sandbox, although poorly written as I have some more stuff to test today. Here's (some of) the complex discoveries about Varona and Tel Mithryn:

• The conversation between her and Talvas causes her to 'hide' from his experiments inside her quarters, without ever leaving, eating or sleeping.
• Finishing the quest From the Ashes (which is triggered by entering Tel Mithryn Tower once, talk to Neloth, and exiting again) will finally make her leave her quarters and start her busy schedule, which includes the conversations with Neloth (when she succeeds in using the weird lift in his tower).
• Her night work package near the Standing Stone will never activate because of a mixup with From the Ashes.
• Last but not least, THE most important thing. She WILL die the moment you leave Tel Mithryn, even if you just walk down to the Standing Stone. Her death is actually triggered by the very welcome she gives you after her convo with Talvas, so it's possible to start Reluctant Steward even before the Dragonborn quest. This means, that of the players will never get to experience her daily life as she will be dead before they even know it (as soon as they wander off the Tel Mithryn cell) - and all the nice recorded conversations and a complex daily schedule has gone to waste.
• When she is dead, Neloth will immediately start complaining about her absence, making it possible to trigger the Reluctant Steward during The Path of Knowledge, even if you just talked to Varona, then started the journey towards the Dwarven ruin with Neloth - halfway to the ruin, Varona will die and her dead body will be transferred to the tree with the three ash spawn. At the same time, Neloth will be given the dialogue about Varona and will suddenly complain about tea. :D

I hope at least some of this helped - good luck with Neloth! You'll need it! ;) --Krusty (talk) 04:48, 1 April 2013 (GMT)

Ah, that's interesting. I'm trying to remember the series of events I followed in my playthroughs - I recall completing From the Ashes, leaving the tower to look for her in her house. She was not there, so when I returned to the tower, Neloth greets me with the "Have you seen Varona? I'm hungry" line - i.e. Reluctant Steward start. I'm certain I didn't leave the Tel Mithryn cell. I'll load up an old save when I get home from work and test out the schedule you posted. --Jimeee (talk) 09:58, 1 April 2013 (GMT)

Images: Varona / Talvas

Hey Krusty, do you have use for File:DB-npc-Varona Nelas 02.jpg and/or File:DB-npc-Talvas Fathryon 02.jpg? Please use/rename/delete as you wish! --Holomay (talk) 16:10, 1 April 2013 (GMT)

Haha, most definitely - thanks a lot, mate (Wuunferth too!). :) --Krusty (talk) 16:23, 1 April 2013 (GMT)

RE: A Favor?

Hi, thanks - it's a big job, but it's getting there. I can't say I have witnessed those lines, however I'm not sure why they would been connected to 'Old Friends' as they are regarding events in 'Reluctant Steward'.

I do know from all my playthroughs that 'Reluctant Steward' must be completed first before 'Old Friends' is triggered as Neloth has the dialogue: "Everything that can go wrong is going wrong. Ash spawn attacks, my house, and even my steward is assassinated." during 'Old Friends'.

I assume you have spoken to the workers straight after Varona died to try and hear these lines? As I assume that is when they would be heard.

I have a question also, have you ever heard Neloth say this line - It seems to be a reply to "I have to know what Miraak knows if I want to stop him", but I always get the other reply, so I'm wondering if there is a condition to hear this reply.

--Jimeee (talk) 12:29, 4 April 2013 (GMT)

Yeah, I think the lines qualifies as "unused" (unfortunately) because they are clearly related to Old Friends - and I have tried every variant I can think of, but to no avail - no Old Friends before a new steward has entered Tel Mithryn. As for your question, I'm slightly confused - I just tested it and I got: "Now that is a dangerous path indeed. Hermaeus Mora gives nothing away for free. You may end up like Miraak, of course. Two power-mad Dragonborn. It could be very interesting." Is that what you're looking for? --Krusty (talk) 21:10, 4 April 2013 (GMT)

It looks like (unsurprisingly) yet another oversight by the devs. The dialogue conditions check if the stage of DLC2TT2 (Old Friends) is >= 200 and <= 210, while clearly DLC2TT1 (Reluctant Steward) was intended in its place. Here are a couple of points behind my reasoning:

• DLC2TT2 has no such stage as 210.
• Stages 200 or 210 (depends if you find the body after or before Neloth asks you to find his missing steward) of DLC2TT1 are set when you find the body, and will remain active until you tell Neloth of Varona's fate.

--Roger (talk) 17:12, 5 April 2013 (GMT)

Dragonborn: Healing a House – prerequisite quest

Hey Krusty, can you please have look at this discussion? --Holomay (talk) 13:06, 10 April 2013 (GMT)

Just FYI, Krusty, this has been taken care of. I confirmed there's no prerequisite in the CK or in game. – Robin Hood  ^(talk) 18:08, 10 April 2013 (GMT)

Houses project

Hi, I noticed your houses project. What is your opinion of sections like "Displayed Merchandise" as seen on Skyrim:Warmaiden's? Should it be merged into the main article under contents? --Jimeee (talk) 15:09, 17 April 2013 (GMT)

Hmm, I haven't thought about stores too much yet - but I guess the section just goes at the bottom. I'll make a test example later and see how it goes. Thanks for the reminder! --Krusty (talk) 15:21, 17 April 2013 (GMT)

Hi, I've noticed your request here. Although I've no idea about how to check them with the CK. Just another reminder for you. The Speech perk Merchant may "allow you to buy any item from a merchant's inventory." Be careful. By the way, I've finished the Adoption page and I have got enough time now. Maybe I can give you a hand. It's really a hard work for me to write a complete page, but I'd be glad to make lists of items in each house/store. Dreamshadow (talk) 05:53, 20 April 2013 (GMT)

Hey there! I made an example page for a new store design here. Not too sure if it matters with the Speech perk here (after all, we’re just writing the contents of the house without being too overcomplicated) but I appreciate your input. When I finally get the project launched (probably next week), feel more than free to sign up as a member. If you check through the examples, you will realize that there is not really an awful lot of writing involved – just an awful lot of patience. ☺ --Krusty (talk) 07:02, 20 April 2013 (GMT)

Very well, I like your example very much. I'd like to join in my first project here. If you agree, leave ALL the Displayed Merchandise for me. I can handle them out. At this moment, I'll put them here. Then I'll add them into each page. Dreamshadow (talk) 08:19, 20 April 2013 (GMT)

Sounds good. I'll see to that the project gets launched as soon as possible. See you there! --Krusty (talk) 09:04, 20 April 2013 (GMT)

Project is now launched and can be found here. --Krusty (talk) 22:19, 21 April 2013 (GMT)

I've added some notes to my sandbox to explain how to get the lists we need. At the same time, I've noticed some interesting facts and noted them down too. Any ideas? Maybe you can give me a hand. Check this page, the older Displayed Merchandise lists are different from mine. I think I need your confirmation. Dreamshadow (talk) 05:42, 26 April 2013 (GMT)

(←) Hmm, I'm not sure I can help with verification. I'll see if I can get some of the other CK wizards to take a look at it and verify. Stay tuned! --Krusty (talk) 08:00, 26 April 2013 (GMT)

Oh, another annoying fact now. Can you believe that the Displayed Merchandise in Fletcher are LEVELED. (the bows in the display case)(Dwarven Bow @ Lv. 27 and Daedric Bow @ Lv. 65) I've confirmed it myself. Although I believe it's a rare case, more info are needed, hopefully with the help of CK. Dreamshadow (talk) 13:44, 26 April 2013 (GMT)

Interesting method to verify displayed merchandise without using the CK, although I'm wondering whether we should count container contents as "displayed merchandise" or not. Granted, they're not literally on display, but neither are they inaccessible to the player. This might also be a good place to have both in-game and CK verification, if we can, though I understand fully why Krusty wants to avoid that...it does tend to overcomplicate the whole process. – Robin Hood  ^(talk) 19:03, 26 April 2013 (GMT)

I see. I don't think it's quite hard to check container contents in game and I can get them done. That's why I join the project and ask other members to leave all Displayed Merchandise sections for me. Personally, I don't think they will change the list we have now. In fact, I've noticed that nearly all Displayed Merchandise have been listed before. I don't know how they got the lists, but I can check my work with them. Things may be much easier than we thought, here are some detailed questions we need an answer:

• Can you buy displayed Orange Dartwing(rare ingredients) at Angeline's Aromatics or Arcadia's Cauldron without Merchant Perk?
• Can you buy soul gems from an alchemy shop (Angeline's Aromatics or Arcadia's Cauldron) with Merchant Perk? (the most significant conflict between my lists and the older lists)
• Do the leveled bows and arrows in Fletcher follow the common leveled list? (It's easy to identify which one are leveled with different saved games)

That's all. Then we can draw some common conclusions that can be applied to all Displayed Merchandise. Dreamshadow (talk) 23:30, 26 April 2013 (GMT)

Thinking about it some more, most container contents are random or semi-random, so perhaps trying to list them would be futile. Let's stick strictly with the actual on-display stuff for the moment.

• As far as Orange Dartwing goes, see Skyrim:Orange Dartwing#Bugs; it's missing the keyword that identifies it as something alchemists can buy and sell. You certainly can't buy it without the Merchant perk, but you can with it.
• To my surprise, soul gems work differently from Orange Dartwings. It looks like you can't buy them even with the Merchant perk. An Xbox player did the initial investigation for me, then I was later able to confirm it on my game after uninstalling the unofficial patch and starting a new game. I have no explanation for why Orange Dartwing is available with the Merchant perk, but Soul Gems aren't.
• There are two leveled bows using LItemWeaponBow, two using LItemWeaponBowTown. The "town" ones level a bit more slowly and top out at Elven, where the regular ones top out at Daedric. The other leveled items appear to use the normal leveled lists for their type, with the exception of one of the leveled sets of arrows, which is marked as "special loot", which means it's calculated as though you were at a higher level than you actually are. For the record, the leveled items are: two war axes, a dagger, three Damage Health potions, four sets of regular arrows, and the aforementioned special loot arrows. – Robin Hood  ^(talk) 01:21, 27 April 2013 (GMT)

Excellent! Another minor request now, I'm not quite sure how to add these leveled items into Displayed Merchandise here properly (I made it with my Lv.65 Wood Elf). Maybe some links to LItemWeaponBow, LItemWeaponBowTown are needed, but I can't find them right now (CSList?). Feel free to edit my sandbox, your help would be welcome. Dreamshadow (talk) 03:28, 27 April 2013 (GMT)

(←) For the most part, we don't have leveled lists on the wiki, but those we do have are at, logically enough, Leveled Lists. That said, I think probably just saying "leveled bow" is sufficient, though you may want to note where it maxes out, like we do in the merchant chest tables (e.g., Moth gro-Bagol). Generally speaking, we don't link to CS List except as an aid to discussion. It's not meant to be high-traffic, and it's not terribly user-friendly. – Robin Hood  ^(talk) 04:22, 27 April 2013 (GMT)

Apologies to Krusty for clogging up his page! Dreamshadow: while doing my checking, I noticed a couple of discrepancies between your lists and Nephele's, so I checked in the CK, and Nephele's lists appeared to be correct. To be doubly sure, though, I created a mod that simply deleted everything from Angelina's merchant chest, thus leaving only the displayed merchandise available. That confirmed Nephele's numbers, apart from the soul gem issue (which still baffles me). I haven't looked to see how many more changes you've made to live pages, but I think we're going to have to go back over them and double-check everything. When there are discrepancies between your numbers and those that're already on the page, we'll need to reconfirm both sets of numbers and figure out where the discrepancy is coming from. – Robin Hood  ^(talk) 05:07, 27 April 2013 (GMT)

I see. Do you mean that all the goods that a merchant can sale are consist of two parts: contents of merchant chest and displayed merchandise? I think this is the key. I've updated the lists of stores that I've already listed in my sandbox and I think they are closer to real game experience, personally. I'll keep working with my sandbox but stop changing our current stores pages. I'd like to see the final answer. Dreamshadow (talk) 05:56, 27 April 2013 (GMT)

That's my understanding, yes. It worked the same way in Oblivion, I believe. – Robin Hood  ^(talk) 06:14, 27 April 2013 (GMT)

Just to sum it up - all stores should look like this page, with a "Displayed Merchandise" section and a "Standard Merchandise" section. The former contains all the displayed merchandise you can buy from the proprietor, while the standard merchandise section contains what is in the merchant chest. --Krusty (talk) 06:25, 27 April 2013 (GMT)

I've checked Angeline's Aromatics in game again, my carelessness. For now, I may pay more attention to checking Nephele's lists to see if all of them are really available and reformat them to meet our new project standard. Dreamshadow (talk) 06:28, 27 April 2013 (GMT)

It is definitely important that this info is spot-on correct - so some kind of double check sounds like a good idea. --Krusty (talk) 00:04, 28 April 2013 (GMT)

Re: Userspace Patroller?

Hi Krusty, I saw your message. If you think setting me as a Userspace Patroller will help others patrolling the Recent Changes then sure, lets go for that. I don't want to create more work for the Patrollers. Also, hope to catch you on IRC sometime, as I had a few question I'd appreciate your input/guidance on :) --Jimeee (talk) 20:23, 27 April 2013 (GMT)

Userspace Patroller?

Looking over our Userspace Patroller List, I noticed one extremely overqualified standout. In fact, this person is not only already a patroller, but an admin!!! Do you think we should remove him from the ranks, so he doesn't intimidate the others? --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 22:26, 1 May 2013 (GMT)

Haha, what the hell? I have no idea how that noob ended up there - feel more than free to help him out of his misery! :D --Krusty (talk) 22:43, 1 May 2013 (GMT)

Done. --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 23:11, 1 May 2013 (GMT)

Detailed Speech Check

Many quests have a speech check to get further progress, shall we list the detailed options down? Some finished Detailed Walkthrough didn't list them out. If necessary, I'd like to finish the work. I like your example here and I am willing to follow your style, if you think it would be all right. (Update, I've made an example in my sandbox, take a look.) Dreamshadow (talk) 01:09, 11 May 2013 (GMT)

Sorry about the later response. Maybe someone already answered this elsewhere, otherwise here goes. We recently created a standard table for the speech checks, and it can be seen here. It's a bit less clumsy than my table on the House of Horrors page, but it should be more or less functional and better-looking. --Krusty (talk) 15:51, 14 May 2013 (GMT)

Glad to see you again. The table looks very good. Just a minor suggestion, most quests with a speech check wouldn't have so many different reactions like this one. They are much simpler, Passed: further progress or Failed:choose a new option and try again. It would look dull to repeat the same reaction in the table. Maybe we can delete the Reaction column in other cases. Another request, I could find every quest with a speech check with Speech page easily. However, we need more DB quests info, they are missing now. Could you give me a hand? Then, I'm willing to fix all speech checks for every related quest with a better and standard table. Dreamshadow (talk) 02:24, 15 May 2013 (GMT)

It would be great to have a consistent layout for all the speech checks - for a less "messy" table, I used it here as well. --Krusty (talk) 03:37, 15 May 2013 (GMT)

Yeah, but I still think the Reaction column looks dull. It's unnecessary to repeat the same results without any new information. I prefer to delete them. Dreamshadow (talk) 04:22, 15 May 2013 (GMT)

Yeah, but there can be more than one or two possible reactions, so it is important to keep the table consistent regardless of how dull it is. ;) --Krusty (talk) 04:51, 15 May 2013 (GMT)

I see. I'll follow this example then. Dreamshadow (talk) 05:01, 15 May 2013 (GMT)

I've made another more common table for it, here, take a look. If the quest have more dialogue, we just need to add more levels of Bulleted list. May I use it as an example then? Dreamshadow (talk) 03:19, 16 May 2013 (GMT)

Yep, that's another way of doing it - but I think there will be exceptions everywhere. What we COULD do is collect all the tables we currently have on some help-page, so people can pick the table that fits their specific needs? --Krusty (talk) 07:43, 16 May 2013 (GMT)

You mean this page? Yeah, many good examples and I need some time to master them. For now, I'll finish the quest "A Few Words with You" with my table first, then I'd like to see if other tables could make the page look better. Dreamshadow (talk) 08:19, 16 May 2013 (GMT)

Re: Question about Tel Mithryn

Hi Krusty. I don't believe that Old Friends always follow straight after Briarheart Necropsy, however it is definitely a prerequisite. It seems in your case, you had met the criteria for Old Friends to start just as you completed Briarheart Necropsy. It's not always the case though.

Also, during Old Friends, Neloth gives the reply: "Fortunately Ildari offered to let me operate on her first. Of course this was before your briarheart expedition. Now I know that I did the surgery all wrong." - which of course alludes to Briarheart Necropsy.

I have 4 playthroughs of DB, and the order in which the Tel Mithryn side quests take place has never been exactly the same. I'm at work right now so I can't check, but I have a list of the order of quest for all 4 characters. I can check to see if there are other prerequisite or dependencies.

--Jimeee (talk) 10:55, 16 May 2013 (GMT)

Okay, thanks for the response. I'll remove Old Friends and the ash spawn attack from the walkthrough, although it WOULD be great to have some kind of quest line-list for Tel Mithryn. Maybe it just doesn't exist? --Krusty (talk) 11:01, 16 May 2013 (GMT)

Yes, I don't believe a true questline order exists. I checked the order I got my quests for my character, you can see them here: User:Jimeee/Sandbox3#Tel_Mithryn_Quest_Notes. From just my 4, I can see:

• Healing a House has no bearing on any of Neloth's quests it seems.
• The first few quest he can give you is either Telvanni Research, Heart Stones or Experimental Subject.
• Reluctant Steward is likely next as it will initiate as soon as you leave the Tel Mithryn cell.
• After Reluctant Steward, Briarheart Necropsy will likely be the next quest - but you can get Wind and Sand or Heart Stones.
• After Briarheart Necropsy, you will likely get Experimental Subject or Heart Stones if you have not already. Otherwise Old Friends becomes available.
• Azra's Staffs seem to only be available after Old Friends, however you may also get Wind and Sand or Experimental Subject if you missed it eariler.
• Heart Stones is repeatable.
• I have a feeling Wind and Sand is level dependent.

If we had more data from others, we could make this more acurate.

--Jimeee (talk) 19:46, 16 May 2013 (GMT)

Thanks for the data. I'll see if I can gather some more info. My own save is a mess, but I can see that I got Reluctant Steward first (for obvious reasons), then From the Ashes and then I triggered Briarheart Necropsy. --Krusty (talk) 19:58, 16 May 2013 (GMT)

Search Results of CSList

Do you remember that I want to search "Persuade" in CSList to find all speech checks in DB? I've got a technical problem now. I can only see the first 50 records and I can't see the rest of them. Any solutions, or, you can find someone to get the full list. Dreamshadow (talk) 04:15, 21 May 2013 (GMT)

Yeah, I remember, and the plan is still good. Still, I’m not exactly sure what the problem is. You may want to hit the IRC during busy hours, so we can figure it out. --Krusty (talk) 05:24, 21 May 2013 (GMT)

Arniel and Enthir...and a whole lot more

I noticed something this time around that I missed when you first asked about them. There's a requirement that they be in the Hall of Countenance...but they don't live in the Hall of Countenance! There are actually 11 such conversations between various pairings of people, and looking around, some of the conversations should genuinely be in the Hall of Countenance, while others should be in the Hall of Attainment. Then there are several which take place between a person living in Attainment and a person living in Countenance (Arniel/Nirya and Faralda/Enthir). I'm not sure if they have any overlap except in the Hall of Elements. So as it stands now, the only conversations will take place in Countenance, nothing will get said in Attainment or Elements. – Robin Hood  ^(talk) 17:49, 23 May 2013 (GMT)

Thank you so much for figuring out what was wrong - guess I'm done basing entire article layouts on the conversations of the College members. --Krusty (talk) 19:30, 23 May 2013 (GMT)

Voice Actors Skyrim

When Bethesda mail the Skyrim voice actors over, will the Skyrim voice actors page have a template saying maintenance is in progress for that time when all the voice actors are added to the page? Dragon Guard (talk) 09:21, 16 June 2013 (GMT)

Skyrim Voice Actor Page Locked

Now that the page is locked for maintenance, how will it be sorted out? And what happens now? Dragon Guard (talk) 20:13, 18 June 2013 (GMT)

Hey Dragon Guard! I felt it necessary to lock the page for the time being, as we have to wait for the expected responses - like I wrote on your talk page. Don't take it the wrong way, this is simply to prevent the article from being filled with guesswork - if you feel like working more on the article, I'd suggest creating a Sandbox and work from there. That way, we can compare results when the mails arrive - and get the correct info on the Wiki. Oh, and don't let this bring you down - I'm sure you have researched everything, but we have to be 100% sure. --Krusty (talk) 20:19, 18 June 2013 (GMT)

Thanks for the answer.

I have a question as well; Can only administrators lock pages from being edited? Dragon Guard (talk) 20:23, 18 June 2013 (GMT)

i am sure Craig Sechler voices Haknir Death-Brand, he voices Gallus as well and their voices sound the same. Again, we should wait until we hear confirmation from Bethesda for this. They might mail a really really long list and for voice actors we already know of. Dragon Guard (talk) 20:42, 18 June 2013 (GMT)

Yes, only administrators can protect pages. For now, we'll just need to wait until we know more official information. ⇠eshe^talk 20:56, 18 June 2013 (GMT)

Anthony Skordi voices characters in the Dragonborn DLC

Discussion moved to Skyrim talk:Voice Actors#Anthony Skordi voices characters in the Dragonborn DLC ⇠eshe^talk 20:09, 19 June 2013 (GMT)

Unlock Skyrim Voice Actors for copy and paste into sandbox

Can you briefly unlock the Skyrim voice actors page for me to copy and paste it into my sandbox? The links only copy and paste that way. And put a message on my talkpage when you have unlocked it. Dragon Guard (talk) 16:36, 20 June 2013 (GMT)

Hi Dragon Guard! I went ahead and copied the current version of the page into your sandbox. Hope you don't mind :). ⇠eshe^talk 16:53, 20 June 2013 (GMT)

Thanks a lot :) Dragon Guard (talk) 17:05, 20 June 2013 (GMT)

Finally Found Out Johanna Torell Does The FemaleShrill Voicetype (Includes Fianna and Viola Giordano)

It says here: http://www.imdb.com/list/DxdwZIvDzXg/ Dragon Guard (talk) 14:12, 23 June 2013 (GMT)

That's a user created list. No way of knowing whether it's real or not. --AN|L (talk) 10:19, 23 June 2013 (EDT)

Johanna Torrell was credited in the game as additional voices, so it could be her. Dragon Guard (talk) 14:28, 23 June 2013 (GMT)

Torrell is credited with voicing female nords (along with Martina Lotun). It doesn't say which female nords she voiced. --AN|L (talk) 14:58, 23 June 2013 (GMT)

(←) Again, this would be more appropriate on the article's talk page or on the forums. Please post this kind of discussion there instead of on user pages. Thanks! ⇠eshe^talk 15:04, 23 June 2013 (GMT)

Bethesda have been given a Week To respond

We gave them until today to respond last week. Since it looks like they are not going to respond, what will happen? Dragon Guard (talk) 05:40, 26 June 2013 (GMT)

Happy Birthday!

Happy happy birthday, Krusty! Hope you have a fantastic day. :D — ABCface^◥ 13:07, 15 July 2013 (GMT)

Happy birthday Krusty! All the best :) ~HellRider ツ^talk ✉^mail 13:09, 15 July 2013 (GMT)

Wow, enjoy this day, happy~ Dreamshadow (talk) 14:25, 15 July 2013 (GMT)

Happy Birthday Krusty! Hope you have an awesome day and eat plenty of real cake :D. Happy birthday! ⇠eshetalk 14:27, 15 July 2013 (GMT)

Happy birthday —Legoless (talk) 15:25, 15 July 2013 (GMT)

Happy Birthday. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 18:13, 15 July 2013 (GMT)

Haha, thanks everybody! --Krusty (talk) 07:53, 16 July 2013 (GMT)

Sorry I missed this earlier. I hope you enjoyed your birthday! --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 19:15, 16 July 2013 (GMT)

Hey Krusty, I wish you a belated Happy Birthday! All the best! :) Holomay (talk) 16:58, 29 July 2013 (GMT)

(←) Maybe I've got the excuse that I wasn't here on that day and could have feasibly missed it, but I'll chirp in with a belated "Happy birthday" as well, since it's in the RC. Happy birthday, old man. And, on a different note, is there any busy work I can aid you in? ES^{(talk•email)} 17:09, 29 July 2013 (GMT)

Warning on my page. Sort this out.

Nocte Canticum put a warning on my page for not using show preview when editing my own userspace. I did use show preview, like.... maybe 7 times. Can you sort this out please? Dragon Guard (talk) 07:49, 23 July 2013 (GMT)

Sorted. --Krusty (talk) 07:51, 23 July 2013 (GMT)