Oblivion talk:Gray Cowl of Nocturnal

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Archive 1: June 2007 to November 2009

Stealing the Grey Cowl of Nocturnal

I was wondering, is it possible to strike the Grey Fox down, rendering him unconscious and use the Pickpocket essential NPCs glitch by activating him while in sneak just as he regains consciousness? Chutney of the Black Marsh 02:50, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

Only if you put a bound helmet on him first.--Corevette789 03:03, 31 January 2010 (UTC)

Stealing the Boots of Springheel Jak

Stealing the Boots of Springheel Jak from Jakben, Earl of Imbel will start the Boots of Springheel Jak quest and let you visit the Gray Fox in Cheydinhal.

The quest page for the boots of Springheel Jak says that the game will tell you to meet the Gray Foc in Cheydinhal, but that he won't be there. This conflicts with the note on the page of the Cowl. Someone needs to verify which is correct. — Unsigned comment by 68.59.234.55 (talk) on 18 February 2010

Fixed. Well spotted. rpeh •T•C•E• 07:38, 18 February 2010 (UTC)

Strictly Lore

we could add that the Cowl was stolen by Emer Dareloth not the Grey fox, which became his persona after the theft. JamesDC99 19:37, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

Okay, I've corrected the basic problem (you were absolutely right) but there still needs to be more work on this so I've marked it for cleanup. rpeh •T•C•E• 23:45, 20 May 2010 (UTC)

Paying off Fox's bounty?

I've seen several references to paying off the Gray Fox's bounty, how there is little point as it'll only work until the next time you wear the cowl. This is all well and good, but paying off the Gray Fox's bounty is literally impossible in my GOTY edition on XBox 360. Doyens do not give an option for paying off the bounty (they act as if you don't have one), and guards will only offer the option of Resist Arrest, both of these seem centered around the idea of preventing you from paying off the Fox's bounty.

Haven't tried the exploit in order to pay it off, but outside of exploits and glitches, the game seems to prevent it's possibility. DaedalusMachina 16:13, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

The bounty can be paid off. But the only person who will pay it off is doyen in Bravil. You only have 2 doyens. One of them won't pay off the bounty and one of them will. I don't know why a payoff doesn't work in imperial city. He will pay off any bounty you incur otherwise but will not pay off gray fox bounty. You must travel to bravil. Guards won't chase you after you pay off the bounty but you can never ever speak to them. Speaking to them sets off the arrest script. — Unsigned comment by 70.234.131.249 (talk) at 06:21 on 11 August 2011 (GMT)

More Lore and Continuity

I've noticed that it's been said that the Nocturnal's Curse must not have effected Emer Dareloth, since he was known, but his successors WERE effected. Where is Emer Dareloth mentioned outside of the Gray Fox's declaration at the end of the questline? We have "Garden of Dareloth" but nobody knows why, thus "Dareloth" is just a word.

The way I see it (which is not really all that important) the Gray Fox used the Elder Scroll to find the original thief (the scrolls could NOT be cursed, as they are Aedric), and once he was able to declare the name, he had done something the curse was supposed to prevent, which removed the curse.

This opinion ASIDE, it was indeed the act of the curse breaking that provided Emer Dareloth's name. Unless his name was mentioned elsewhere, the curse still applied to him. --DaedalusMachina 16:29, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

The name isn't mentioned anywhere else in Oblivion. But I think to lift the curse, it would require that The Gray Fox say the name. The curse is still somewhat there though (or maybe its just the mask itself) since you can take the mask on/off to your advantage.Mikeyboy52 16:48, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

So, then, would you agree that the note that the curse did not effect Emer Dareloth is false? DaedalusMachina 18:21, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

It didn't effect him untill he put the mask on. While going through the Thieves Guild questline, you'll find out that the Cowl was always cursed, by Nocturnal herself. Mikeyboy52 08:53, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

archive

I thought, since it seems to be "archiving season" perhaps this long talk page might need archiving. I'm not sure if it would be within my "user rights" to archive oblivion namespace talk pages. Mikeyboy52 16:35, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

While patrollers and admins tend to be the people who do the job, any user is welcome to archive any talk page if it needs it. So go nuts! :) If you need help, or you want me to take a look over it when you're done, just ask. I'm also on IRC right now if you need a more immediate response for some reason. ‒ Robin Hood↝Talk 19:26, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

I dont understand how you archive a page do you create a new page like over here it would be Oblivion talk:Gray Cowl of Nocturnal/Archive 1 and then copy and paste the data there and then remove it from this page or is here another way to do it? --Arny 19:33, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

That's exactly how you do it, Arny. Then usually you'd add {{Archive Header}} to the top, and maybe {{Nav Footer}} on the bottom if it's a series of archives. ‒ Robin Hood↝Talk 19:39, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Ok ill try but can you check after I do it to see of I did it right (and can you add the archive link to this page like other pages have?) --Arny 19:45, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Not a problem. The easiest way is just to copy one from another page that already has one. That makes sure you don't forget anything and that the formatting is consistent. ‒ Robin Hood↝Talk 19:54, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Once you're done, you'll see I've left you a template at the top of the page. Just remove the lines with the <!-- and --> and change "MonthStart to MonthEnd" to something like "March 2007 to December 2009" or whatever months are appropriate. ‒ Robin Hood↝Talk 20:07, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

(←) Help I messed up on the top of the archive it says "This is an archive of past UESPWiki:Community Portal discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page, except for maintenance such as updating links." can somebody fix my mess im sorry --Arny 20:23, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

You did fine. That's my fault for not mentioning the specifics to you (mostly cuz I always forget them myself until I hit Show Preview). I just fixed it up; nothing major. You can look at the changes to see what I did. ‒ Robin Hood↝Talk 20:30, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Phew thought I messed it up real bad the next time I think somebody more knowledgeable about this wiki should do it im really bad at it --Arny 20:42, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

I should really have read that archive header page, but usually on this wiki when people say stuff like use {{NewLine}} I just use it thinking that I dont have to add anything (which you usually dont) so I just add it without thinking --Arny 20:50, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

Yup, and that was my fault entirely because I forgot about that part of it. As for someone else archiving, practice makes perfect. There's nothing you can mess up on a wiki that can't be fixed, so don't worry about it. ‒ Robin Hood↝Talk 21:43, 8 June 2010 (UTC)

(←) btw anyother page that need to be archived I can try another one Arny 08:22, 9 June 2010 (UTC)

Odd Occurence

I'm currently playing through the Shivering Isles main quest, and am in the Howling Halls hunting Ciirta. I noticed that when I have the cowl on, the 500 gold bounty has vanished. Does anyone know why? Corvus 16:33, 3 July 2010 (UTC)

If you look under the notes section, you will find this; Stouf761 01:11, 26 July 2010 (UTC)

• Wearing the cowl does not truly give you a second identity. The majority of the game's scripts are not set up to treat you any differently when you are wearing the cowl. Therefore, other than the specific effects noted in this article, most aspects of gameplay are not altered by the cowl.
  • The Gray Cowl's effects do not work in the Shivering Isles. If you put it on in Sheogorath's Realm, you will still gain the enchantments (Fortify Sneak 25 points, Detect Life 120 ft., and Feather 200 points), but no one will say to you, "You're the Gray Fox!", and guards will not arrest you.

Bounty Subtraction?

I'm having a little trouble comprehending this phrase:

"the Gray Fox's bounty, which is 500 gold minus your own bounty at the time on donning the Cowl to start."

It sounds like it means: 500 - your starting bounty = your Gray Fox bounty. I'm quite sure that is wrong... --99.237.118.215 12:01, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

That's right. It's an overly-roundabout way of saying that your bounty is always set to 500 when you don the cowl. Feel free to improve the wording. rpeh •T•C•E• 13:54, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

I think the IP is right, that statement doesn't say it at all, even in a roundabout way. Not that I can see anyway. I'll fix it if nobody else has Corvus 14:27, 5 July 2010 (UTC)

Gray fox

How many is the infamy that the gray cowl has? — Unsigned comment by 189.180.113.87 (talk)

The Gray Cowl will add 100 points to your infamy. Vesna 03:48, 12 July 2010 (UTC)

Feather Effect not competely working

My character's regular weight he can carry is 235, while holding the Scales of Pitiless Justice. However, donning the Gray Cowl only increases his encumberance to 373, instead of 435, which, as the feather effect is 200 pts, it should do. Is this a glitch in the feather effect as a whole, or just the feather effect attached to the gray cowl? Is there a way to put it right, without the console as I am on Xbox 360? — Unsigned comment by 86.27.248.222 (talk) on 24 July 2010

See the description of this bug here. rpeh •T•C•E• 20:09, 24 July 2010 (UTC)

moved

"I've lost the cowl due to attempting to transfer games from one account to another on the same xbox and losing everything in a chest. Is there anyway for me to get it back?76.104.9.23 12:35, 22 August 2010 (UTC)"

--GUM!!! 12:40, 22 August 2010 (UTC)

gaurds

the article kind of metioned this but i didnt see anything about guards, the article says if you take the mask off infront of people they wont think you are the gray fox, does this include guards, so if you get arrested and resist then take the mask off will they still attack you and everything? Lindenbrock 20:55, 14 October 2010 (UTC)

In my experience, there can sometimes be a lag that pops up which causes the incurred bounty while wearing the Cowl to carry over when you remove it, should you remove the cowl immediately after committing a crime. This lag is not consistently present, but I was able to track it more than once (killed a guard with the cowl on, did not incur any bounty for it, removed the cowl, a 1000 coin bounty was placed on my unmasked character instead of the Gray Fox). — Unsigned comment by 98.246.104.44 (talk) at 03:09 on 21 October 2010

Gray Fox Bounty?

Ok, so I was doing the story mission where you have to go and destroy the Oblivion Gate for Anvil. I go inside (with the cowl) and come back out (with the cowl). And when I went to remove it I noticed that my cowl-less character now had the Gray Fox's bounty and Infamy. Then, thinking it was caused by destroying the Gate, I reload my last save (it was in the tower where the Sigil is). The bounty was still there. So I go to turn myself in (had to go to jail, they wouldn't let me pay the bounty even though I had the money) and the bounty was STILL THERE. I realize I'm more or less screwed, but I've spent so much time on the character I really don't want to start over. Is there nothing I can do about this? It's on the Xbox 360 by the way, no console commands for me. — Unsigned comment by 75.74.189.138 (talk)

Thats a serious problem for Xbox, you can try paying half the bounty to a Doyen without the cowl, but I have no idea if that will really fix it. --Wizy 01:10, 30 November 2010 (UTC)

add on: this will help, if you have shivering isles and go in with the mask on,take it off and go back out you have the infumy and what not of the grey cowl and if u put it on it has the reverse effect. since being in the shivering isles doesnt effect the cowl. if you go in after you have gotten the infumy and once input it back on and come out with it on then it reverts back

so go in with it on and come out with it off = your normal character has the cowls infumy

(after doing that)

go in with it off and come out with it on= cowl geting the cowls infumy stats back and normal character geting there stats back

it must be the same with the gates... so just do that — Unsigned comment by 24.15.17.247 (talk) on 10 Decemeber 2010

nocturnal

What happens if you summon nocturnal (through her shrine) whilst wearing the cowl? (Eddie the head 08:05, 10 January 2011 (UTC))

As stated here, the answer is 'no'. --Krusty 10:30, 10 January 2011 (UTC)

thanks — Unsigned comment by Eddie the head (talk • contribs) at 10:20 on 11 January 2011

Way shrines with gray cowl

i havent tested this yet but is it possible to do the wayshrines with the gray cowl and the infamy will reset making no one attack you with the cowl on? — Unsigned comment by Secret Chief (talk • contribs) at 20:00 on 12 January 2011 (UTC)

Taken from the article "You cannot do the Pilgrimage for the Knights of the Nine with the Gray Cowl on. If you attempt to activate any wayshrine while wearing the Gray Cowl you are told "The gods are not mocked! They require an honest heart, not one hidden behind a false face.". I already asked you to start researching your queries first, please at least read the relevant articles first. Alpha Kenny Buddy 19:38, 12 January 2011 (UTC)

Gray Cowl: Oblivion only?

Is the gray cowl only mentioned in oblivion? Because I want to add it to the artifacts of tamriel, in the lore section of the website, but to qualify it needs mentioned in two games. I want to split this article into a lore, and ob specific articles, but where in the lore article would I place the gray cowl? Western3589 20:02, 21 January 2011 (UTC)

Gray Cowl negates face change from vampirism

Something I found a while back; even with the vampire cure potion the player's face retains some of the changes made by becoming a vampire. If you use the potion while the Cowl is equipped this will not happen, you will regain your original appearance.

202.154.135.84 08:50, 23 February 2011 (UTC) spruce56

gray cowl during dark brotherhood quests?

if you wear the cowl during the brotherhood quests does it still raise your infamy? or are the murders just attributed to the gray fox? Klouderoth 03:25, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

The text says: Any crimes committed (or good deeds done) are attributed to the Gray Fox rather than to the character wearing the hood. --Brf 12:00, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

right but we aren't just talking about any regular crimes, we are talking about an entire quest line Klouderoth 19:59, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

Right. So you would not be able to wear the Cowl if you wanted those crimes to count as yours, just like any other crime concerning the Cowl. --Brf 20:04, 25 February 2011 (UTC)

(←) but it also says "Wearing the cowl does not truly give you a second identity. The majority of the game's scripts are not set up to treat you any differently when you are wearing the cowl. Therefore, other than the specific effects noted in this article, most aspects of gameplay are not altered by the cowl." Klouderoth 23:59, 26 February 2011 (UTC)

Or to put it another way: it was the Gray Fox who got the infamy for helping Francois Motierre to fake his own death, but it was my character who received the payment and bonus for successful completion of the contract. Sheogorath. 217.212.231.206 21:19, 2 January 2013 (GMT)

I just played through the entire DB quest line, without removing the hood once. I put it on immediately after offing that annoying little 'tree climber' in Skingrad (no spoiler there -lol). Erm.. it was a shame about Dion, though. He arrived at the scene just a few moments after the murder and naively tried to arrest me! Anyway, the point of this (test) playthrough was to see exactly what the Gray Cowl is good for, and that is - not very much imho. other than saving the cash you would otherwise pay to your Doyen. Why do I say this? Because, when the questline was over, my PCMiscStats were a complete and utter disaster. All of the murders, trespassing, forced thefts, pickpockets, highest bounty etc. etc. were attributed to my normal toon. The only thing NOT attributed to my normal toon was the infamy. Well, at least the Infamy worked properly by not removing the Cowl at all I suppose. However, Infamy is pretty much a joke with KOTN installed, again, imho.. 90.199.159.44 16:06, 25 January 2019 (UTC)

Completing Campaign

Been a while since the game has been released, not sure anyone will reply its been such a long time, but: I completed the main story line wearing the grey cowl. Afterwards, i could wear the cowl whenever i wanted, and guards would not run after me. If i talked to the guards they would arrest me, but as long as i didn't talk to them, they never ran for me. Some commented saying 'your the grey fox' but did nothing anyway! Bug?

If you completed the main storyline while wearing the gray cowl then the fame you gained from those missions counteracted the infamy of the cowl. This means many people will probably have a high disposition towards you, and wont attack or report you.--Catmaniac66 16:48, 30 May 2011 (UTC)

Moved from article

Stealing the Grey Cowl and then finishing the thieves guild guest line will result in you getting two cowls. If you are currently wearing one of the cowls you can not equip the other. The stolen item marker on the pick pocketed cowl can be cleared by having both cowls in your inventory then trying to clone the non-stolen cowl using the scroll duplication(see glitches). I am not sure if this works with ether cowl but i know it works with the properly acquired one. The separate personalty is attached to the cowl its self. (In other words you can be the Grey Fox with a bounty of 3000 fame 1 and infamy 120 then switch cowls and be the Grey Fox with a bounty of 500 fame 0 and infamy 100.)

This addition shouldn't be on the article, as it counts as a glitch. --Krusty 07:52, 4 June 2011 (UTC)

Gray Cowl After the Curse

This is more of a lore/conjecture thing, but it's been driving me crazy. We know that initially, the cowl turns one into the Gray Fox when worn and one becomes a nameless stranger after taking it off. We also know that after the curse is broken, wearing the cowl turns one into the Gray Fox, and removing it returns one to his own identity, name and all. We also know from the in-game text that "the cowl's magic makes it so that anyone seeing me remove the cowl does not associate me with the Gray Fox." I would think that this is why the previous Gray Foxes could never be apprehended. If they were seen, they took the cowl off and became just another face in a crowd.

The only obstacle to this theory is the dialogue between Corvus and Millona at the end of the ultimate heist. Corvus takes the cowl off in front of Millona after breaking the curse, but he is still able to make her and the player understand that he is/was the Gray Fox.

So how do you guys think the cowl's magic works after the curse is broken? Can the bearer reveal himself as the Gray Fox if he chooses to? Is Corvus still aware of the player's identity or does he just know that he gave the cowl to a successor whose name he can't remember? I would be interested to hear any theories on this.

And before you ask, yes, I am aware that I've spent too much time thinking about small details. 71.125.148.83 20:22, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

As per Corvus revealing himself, I believe that the curse was broken, or at least broken enough at the time for the reveal to not be wiped by the magic. Either he had already broken the curse, or the revealing itself was the final curse breaking. As for the player and Corvus, I would assume that because of the Cowl's magic, the player and the Grey Fox are accepted as different people to Corvus, while not wearing the Cowl. Corvus knew that the player was given the Cowl. But I think that while wearing the Cowl, the magic would make him forget that, until seeing the player as a separate entity. Those are all assumptions though, of course. It is difficult to try to use logic to explain thing s that are not possible in real life. :þ --DKong27 ^{Talk Cont} 20:39, 13 June 2011 (UTC)

The curse was broken, therefore Corvus could reveal that he was the Gray Fox. Before the curse was broken, it doesn't matter if the owner of the cowl is wearing the cowl or not. He/she has no identity when not wearing the cowl and becomes the Gray Fox when wearing it. After the curse was broken, the cowl's magic only works when you are wearing it. You're the Gray Fox when wearing it, but you're just you when you're not wearing it. Corvus is very aware of his successor's identity because the curse was broken.
Ongoingwhy^Talk 10:27, 17 September 2011 (UTC)

Duplicate 'Gray Cowl of Nocturnal'

The notes state that 'If duplicated, the cowl still maintains its enchantments but loses the bounty and identity scripts.'. But how can the cowl be duplicated this way? I tried everything but only get it to duplicate WITH bounty and identity scripts. — Unsigned comment by 188.99.245.238 (talk) at 01:42 on 24 June 2011 (UTC)

Grey Cowl Influence

There are several obscure NPCs that remain unchanged by the effects of the Cowl. For example: The Adoring Fan that appears after the Arena quest line will still see you as the Arena Grand Champion not as the Grey Fox. — Unsigned comment by 71.198.239.71 (talk) at 04:29 on 26 June 2011

Maybe Adoring Fan is not what we think he is, maybe he is some - super-dimensional creature that is unaffected by the cowl, and he is watching us for his masters? ;P — Unsigned comment by 95.49.91.105 (talk) at 10:54 on 22 August 2011

Guard captains

If you resist arrest with the gray cowl on Imperial guard Captains, such as Carmalo Truiand, Audens Avidius and even Heironymus Lex, will still sometimes say "I'll make captain for this!". Should this be added to the Notes section? 79.97.40.245 11:44, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

It's just standard guard dialogue. Yes it's a little odd that a captain will talk about making captain, but it's not a huge deal. rpeh •T•C•E• 11:52, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

And it's already noted on Lex's page. Kitkat1749 ^{•Talk•Contrib•E-mail} 11:57, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

Ok sorry about that. 79.97.40.245 12:50, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

Absolutely no problem =) -- Kitkat1749 ^{•Talk•Contrib•E-mail} 12:54, 4 September 2011 (UTC)

Shrine of sithis

Would wearing the cowl allow you to use the shrine of Sithis in Deepscorn Hollow, if so it should probably be added to the notes. RIM 21:15, 13 September 2011 (UTC)

Fast Travel/Wait Glitch?

No matter what, no matter how I do it, now that I've picked up the Gray Cowl, I ALWAYS hove guards chasing me. Or at least the game thinks I do whenever I try to wait or fast travel... Should this be added to the page as a glitch?

This occurs no matter what I do. I've tried: Unequipping it. Dropping it. Leaving the area, unequipping it then returning to the area. Leaving the area, DROPPING it, then returning to the area.

NOTHING works. I'm at a loss here. — Unsigned comment by 173.80.146.251 (talk) at 03:48 on October 3, 2011

have you tried yielding to a guard after taking the cowl off? (^{I plead Lazyness}_{Eddie The Head} 08:50, 3 October 2011 (UTC))

have you tried just talking to the guards? 112jesse 19:55, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

How would that help? Kitkat xxx ^{•Talk•Contrib•E-mail} 19:58, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

If he talked to a guard without the Cowl on, assuming he had no bounty, then the guards should all leave search and arrest mode. --DKong27 ^{Tk Ctr Em} 20:00, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

Not sure what the glitch cause is but you can duplicate the cowl and it wont have the scripted effetcs including the bounty, you could try that. RIM 20:05, 3 October 2011 (UTC)

I've tried all of these things. NOTHING. No matter what, whether there are actual guards chasing me or not, the game SAYS there are. I even tried going to jail, paying gold, resisting arrest, then getting away, Getting Armand to pay off my fines, nothing. Also, it's even worse that I'me on the console version and have no scripting options...— Unsigned comment by 173.80.146.251 (talk) at 03:48 on October 3, 2011

SI Glitch

(moved from the article)

Going into the Shivering Isles with the cowl on, then leaving it on, and then exiting the Shivering Isles with it on, will glitch up your bounty, and give your normal character what your Gray Fox bounty was, and your Gray Fox bounty will be reset to 500.

I don't understand this... can someone make it clearer? rpeh •T•C•E• 09:16, 29 October 2011 (UTC)

I think he means that your normal bounty will be increased to whatever your GC bounty was. For example, if you killed 50 people and got a huge bounty while using the cowl, it would be transfered to your normal character rather than the gray fox, never happened to me though.RIM 09:38, 29 October 2011 (UTC)

I'm skeptical about this. There is a long script specifically meant to make sure that the Gray Cowl doesn't mess anything up with the change between Cyrodiil and the Isles. Although maybe if you could act faster than the script loads? But I believe the script was run on activate (of the Strange Door) so it should be done instantly, right? But anyway, it sounds like a relatively one off. --DKong27 ^{Tk Ctr Em} 16:15, 29 October 2011 (UTC)

Grey Cowl of Noctunal NOT fixed with item removal in Sanguine quest

When the Sanguine quest removes all of your items, the Grey Cowl of Nocturnal stats are left on the character (PC) even with the Unofficial Oblivion Patch installed.

You cannot remove the cowl before the spell hits, and it is forcily removed as soon as the spell hits, therefore you cannot remove it after the spell hits as in the stated solution for not getting bounty/jail time. — Unsigned comment by 24.55.213.129 (talk) at 04:00 on 27 March 2013

Attacking A Mage's Guild Member While Wearing The Cowl

So The members of the Mage's Guild frankly know you are the gray fox as you can still get kicked out for attacking a member while wearing the cowl. — Unsigned comment by PrinceRetro (talk • contribs) at 18:16 on 8 May 2018 (UTC)

Yep, only the bounty and fame/infamy is attributed to the Fox. —Legoless (talk) 18:26, 8 May 2018 (UTC)

Its because the scripts are not set up to recognise the situation. It is also the 6th note on the page so it is already known. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 18:59, 8 May 2018 (UTC)