User talk:Rpeh/Arc 200806

This is an archive of previous comments on my talk page. Please do not post a message here - use this link to go to the active page instead. Thanks.

Image Categories

Just curious how exactly you're classifying pictures in these categories, since I notice that RoBoT is doing the work - I was thinking for example that an NPC picture would be anything with the word "NPC" in the title, but obviously some of them have been uploaded with non-standard names, and you managed to catch those anyhow. So I assume you're just taking any image that appears on an NPC page? (Or Quest page for quest images, Place page for maps, etc.) What in that case happens when an image is used on more than one type of page? For instance, in many cases, an NPC image may be used both on the NPC's page, and also on a related quest or location page. Would this qualify as both an NPC and a quest image? Incidentally, would it be possible to come up with a RoBoT-generated list of all images that are not currently classified? Uncategorized images isn't good enough, because most images now have categories based just on the licensing, so you'd have to do a search for all images that have no categories OTHER than their licensing categories. We're also going to need to have some sort of general images category for images that are used site-wide - things like vendor icons on merchant pages, the health+magicka icons on NPC/creature pages, weight/health/value/etc. icons on item pages, and so forth. Plus non-game-specific images, like the UESP logo and the canvas background image, and other sorts of more-site-specific-than-game-specific type images. But kudos on starting work on this - I was trying to get something like this going several months ago, but without bots it would've been a prohibitively tedious task. --TheRealLurlock ^Talk 14:53, 1 June 2008 (EDT)

At the moment it's very basic - RoBoT is looking at the NPC Summary, Quest Header and (Morrowind|Oblivion|) Place Summary templates. Whatever is the Image parameter is getting an appropriate category. That means some pictures will be in multiple categories because, for instance, we use several NPC images on quest pages. Once this lot has finished (it's been running for about 9 hours and I'd guess it's got about another 7 to go) I'll start thinking about the other images and how we can go about doing those. RoBoT can certainly generate a list but we'll need to think about categories for the others. On that subject, thanks for creating the missing categories - My brain is swimming with different combinations of the game names and the words "NPC", "Quest" and "Images" and I could no longer tell which ones I needed to do! –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 15:01, 1 June 2008 (EDT)

Okay. This sandbox has a list of all the images on the site and the number of categories they're in. Please do NOT edit that page - it's huge! A lot of the ones with no categories can be done easliy - maps for instance. Others will take a bit more thought. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 07:00, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

Nice. This does, of course, reveal the weakness in RoBoT's criteria - I noticed that several of the ones listed as "Three Categories" are actually only in one or two - but they got tagged multiple times because, for example, they're used on multiple quest pages, e.g.: Image:MW MolagBal.jpg or Image:Redoranstrong.jpg. Might not be too difficult if you do another run of these to have RoBoT check before adding a category to see if that exact category already exists on the image. --TheRealLurlock ^Talk 09:03, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

Yes I noticed that too. I didn't realise that any images would be used twice in the same way so didn't include a check to see if a new category was already present. I have slapped myself on the wrist for that (and the misspelling of the MW place category) and it won't happen again. Do you have any suggestions for particular categories? Maps for sure. Icons? –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 09:13, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

Well, some Icons categories already exist (at least for Morrowind) at Category:Images-Morrowind-Icons. Now, the naming convention is slightly different from what you've been putting together, and it's possible we might want to sic a bot on those to make it all consistant, but that was what I had previously put together back when I was trying to arrange for these categories to be the standard. What else? Do we want to distinguish between external world-maps and interior cave-type maps? Or just lump them all together? I'm just thinking, especially for Oblivion with multiple interior maps for just about every location, it might be better to keep the external world maps separate so they don't get swamped and lost in a sea of internal maps. We also need a category or set of categories for items pictures, either those closeups of Artifacts, or the ones I did of the armor and weapons by material/style etc., as well as Ingredient pictures, etc. We also have all the Plant pictures, which might go in with Ingredients, or maybe keep them separate. Also Creatures, (which reminds me that we still need better pictures for most of the MW creatures - the ones we have are mostly kind of old, and really small and against black instead of in their native habitat, etc.) That's all I can think of at the moment, though I'm sure we'll come up with more as we break down that sandbox of yours. --TheRealLurlock ^Talk 12:21, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

Sorry to jump in here, but I noticed the discussion of naming icon image files. I'm currently working on Morrowind:Base Clothing, and before I get too much farther I guess I need to know what (if any) the naming convention is going to be. I don't want to create a bunch of work for someone else (even if it's a bot) if I can avoid it.

On another topic, I've also noticed the images on the Creatures page; perhaps that could be my next project. – KJR1012 ^{Talk Email Contribs} 12:54, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

Well the naming convention is one thing - you can see the guidelines here - this is about adding categories afterwards. I have to say that I think Lurlock's categories are the wrong way around. I'd have Morrowind-Images-Icons-Armor and Morrowind-Images-Icons-Clothing-Amulets and so on. I wouldn't worry too much about these as adding categories really isn't such a huge deal and I'd rather get them right first and add them where necessary than put some on now only to have to change them later. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 14:27, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

Well, the general convention in category naming is always largest-to-smallest. In other words, there are far more images in total on the site than there are just Morrowind images. This is why "Images-" is first in the categories I designed. I'm not dead-committed to that philosophy, though. It might be possible to make an exception for the Images section. It's just that following the conventions of the rest of the categories, it seemed most logical at the time to put the overarcing categories first, in this case "Images". But since this particular category mountain has two peaks as it were (Category:Morrowind and Category:Images, it's a little hard to say which should take precedence... --TheRealLurlock ^Talk 19:56, 2 June 2008 (EDT)

Hi

Hi I just created the Believers page.

When I was done I saw there was a thing that I hadn't put there, it stood like: No subpages and under it stood [+] Believers. How can I get rid of it? - Goblin Lair 11:54, 3 June 2008, (EDT)

It's because you put the category page itself into the category. I have removed it, which has got rid of the [+] section. --Gaebrial 05:58, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

Warn next time?

Would it be fair enough to warn 220.238.158.163 and 220.238.254.20 next time they add unverified statements to the wiki such as on the numerous count and countess pages? They have been given advice and unoficcialm warnings in the past and i no longer consider them to be in good faith, so unless you say otherwise i intend to give tham an ocficcial warning next time they add these unverified comments. --Volanaro 08:57, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

I'm inclined to agree with you, but may I suggest that you leave the warning to a patroller or admin? This is a case where it's not clear-cut that a warning is justified and I feel it's better if it comes from site staff.

I don't want to discourage you in any way, and I'm not suggesting that admins or patrollers are superior to editors, it's just that where there are boundary issues it's better to have a badge to back things up a bit. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 09:16, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

Fair enough, I'll leave it to you or another admin/patroller then, by the way, i sent a reply to your email, thanks for that.--Volanaro 09:18, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

New Article

How do you create a new article--MonsterSlayer 10:30, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

Don't worry I just found out--MonsterSlayer 11:10, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

Sorry - you asked just as I got busy at work. Looks like you've got the hang of it though! –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 12:41, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

MAINSPACE Game Redirects

Hi Rpeh,

Trust me to bring up an almost two month old subject again... Regarding those MAINSPACE game redirects I created, which you then prodded, with the reason that they interfere with the site's search system. I don't think they do. After reading Nephele's reason why similar game redirects shouldn't exist, found here, I'm pretty sure they're safe. To sum up Nephele's reason:

1. Search will search MAINSPACE, then other NAMESPACES, so if a MAINSPACE article exists, it takes priority.
2. Therefore a reader may wish to see game-specific information on a certain subject. (An example was [[:Skyrim]])
3. However when a reader types /wiki/Shivering_Isles, it's almost certain that he's looking for the article [[Shivering:Shivering]]
4. The page [[:Redguard]] doesn't exist, because the reader may wish to see information on the race. This may be solvable through a Disambiguation, similar to Arena.

I know that's a pretty oversized arguement for the existence of just one redirect, but I'm just trying to clarify the matter.

One other thing I thought is that we might want to turn Oblivion into a disambiguation for Oblivion:Oblivion and Lore:Oblivion. - Game Lord^{Talk|Contribs} 11:36, 3 June 2008 (EDT)

Link updates

Hi Rpeh,

I just turned Oblivion into a disambiguation page, as you may have seen. I was wondering if you could get RoBoT to replace all [[:Oblivion]] links with [[Oblivion:Oblivion|]] links. Thanks. - Game Lord^{Talk|Contribs} 08:49, 4 June 2008 (EDT)

It had already been working on it for 30 minutes before you asked :-) –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 08:51, 4 June 2008 (EDT)

Oh, yeah, I can see that now looking at RoBoT's contributions. Thanks anyway then! - Game Lord^{Talk|Contribs} 08:53, 4 June 2008 (EDT)

Removing Clutter Info on Quest Pages

I've tried to cut away any unnecessary information on Sanguine's quest and placed the paraphrased version in my Sandbox. Could you give it a quick scan and mention any other info that could be done without or vital info I missed? I'm working on cleaning up the Daedric Quests pages, and rather than going back later, I want to try it now. Vesna 10:44, 5 June 2008 (EDT)

Dont know if its necessary but...

As you may have seen from my Test Edits page, I have been working on a header for bot userpages and was wondering if you'd like to help improving it and testing it, if you see anything on it that you want to change then you have my psermission to alter the page, thanks --Volanaro 10:29, 6 June 2008 (EDT)

One thing I was hoping to put on the header was a link for administrators to block the associated bot if it continued to malfunction after a message had been posted on its talk page. something like "Administrators, if the bot continues to malfunction after this please [link block it] with the reason, Bot Malfunctioning" --Volanaro 10:34, 6 June 2008 (EDT)

At the moment this is probably what it would look like on RoBoT's page

(Line removed, see below)

what do you think? --[[User:Volanaro|Volanaro <sup>•[[User_Talk:Volanaro|Talk]]]] 14:04, 11 June 2008 (EDT) (i nedd to sort out my signature!)

It's... fine, but I don't think a template is necessary for something that is only going to be used on two or three pages. One of my ongoing, background projects is to reduce the number of templates because the profusion that we have at the moment can be a bit confusing, so I doubt I'll be using this. Good to see you getting the hang of templates though! –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 14:10, 11 June 2008 (EDT)

Ok, I was only really doing it to learn about templates like you said, I have been doing a lot of experimenting with my pc at the moment and thhat includes on the wiki. (so if the whole site goes down you know who to blame!) thanks --Volanaro 14:16, 11 June 2008 (EDT)

Just so you know, I removed the header from here because i am now using the page it was on for something else, resulting in pure nonsense being shown here --Volanaro 08:30, 25 June 2008 (EDT)

Rollback needed

How am I going to put this... I seem to have inflicted some serious damage on NPC pages related to the Oblivion:The_Order_of_the_Virtuous_Blood_(faction). I was trying to get them to appear as "The Order of the Virtuous" blood category, and aim the link in the infobox past a disambiguation. I'm still not totally sure where I went wrong, but if you could rollback the pages I've caused more serious damage on, it would be a help. Thanks, and sorry. - Game Lord^{Talk|Contribs} 08:41, 7 June 2008 (EDT)

I've actually managed to revert the damage myself now. I'm not even sure why I posted this message. I guess I was just looking for somewhere to apologize. - Game Lord^{Talk|Contribs} 08:44, 7 June 2008 (EDT)

Thanks!

I really appreciate the words of support! It means a lot. --GuildKnight^Talk2me 16:10, 8 June 2008 (EDT)

Thanks for the cookie

It was a lot of work for those icons. Next, I'm planning to tackle the Morrowind:Base Armor page, then maybe back to icons for the Morrowind:Miscellaneous Items and Morrowind:Clutter pages.– KJR1012 ^{Talk Email Contribs} 06:06, 9 June 2008 (EDT)

Signature

Hi Rpeh, I have been tyring to figure this out for ages and have got abosolutely nowhere, hence the following, how do i change my signature to have more than just a link to my page, i would like to have a link to my contribs and talk pagea as well and its been bugging me almost ever since i joined the wiki! --Volanaro 07:26, 10 June 2008 (EDT)

You can put anything in the signature box, but make sure you have the "raw signatures" option checked. For instance: this is my sig : –[[User:Rpeh|Rpeh]]<sup>•[[User_Talk:Rpeh|T]]•[[Special:Contributions/Rpeh|C]]•[[Special:Emailuser/Rpeh|E]]•</sup>.

Would you beleive me if i said id seen that box a thousand times but only just noticed it! --Volanaro 14:04, 10 June 2008 (EDT)

Dagoth

no Dagoth aint me

He is causing so much hassel on the various wikis he is on, that I started a campaign to let people know what he is up to. — Unsigned comment by 92.4.135.211 (talk)

As Nephele recently suggested on her talk page, if you want to start a campaign against somebody you shouldn't hide behind an anonymous IP address. At the moment, your actions are reminiscent of cyber-stalking and I'd rather you didn't continue. We're already well aware of Dagoth's activities on other wikis. We're also well aware of the posts that Graxx (the other page you edited) made on this and other wikis. If you have a point, please come out and make it - and sign your name on it. If you're not prepared to do so, please desist. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 10:30, 10 June 2008 (EDT)

Good Game

This user is quick.

No. It wasn't a good game. It was vandalism and I stopped it. If you think it's funny you need to grow up. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 08:36, 12 June 2008 (EDT)

Hircine

Hi Rpeh! You removed my first contribution to the UESP concerning whether the name Hircine may be derived from the word Ursine. Is there any way I can speculate without being scolded? Also, is it possible to contact Bethesda and find out if it might be true? Jigmeister 14:18, 14 June 2008 (EDT)

I didn't scold you - I just undid your edit. As I said in my edit summary, any link between "Hircine", the Daedric Prince of the Hunt, and "Ursine", an adjective meaning "bearlike" is speculative at best. They sound alike and that's about it. Given that Hircine always appears with antlers, he's more likely to be based on Herne the Hunter and other varieties of the Horned God of Celtic Mythology, but even that is just guesswork. If you want to contact Bethesda and ask them about this, knock yourself out. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 15:01, 14 June 2008 (EDT)

OK. Would I be able to help out by taking screenshots of things or something like that?

Sorry if I offended you by using the term "scolded" I just thought it would be an amusing way of wording it & being a n00b I missed out on the existance of an edit summary. Jigmeister 15:36, 14 June 2008 (EDT)

You didn't offend me - I was more worried about having offended you! You can find a list of pages needing images here, but there aren't many left now! –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 07:50, 16 June 2008 (EDT)

Phew, I was a bit worried there. thanks for the help! Jigmeister 16:50, 16 June 2008 (EDT)

By the way, a great many gods have antlers — Unsigned comment by Drake3555 (talk • contribs)

Spelling

First thanks for the attendance. As you may have already figuerd out, English isn't my native language. Therefore I use an online dictionary, namely http://dict.leo.org, in case I'm not sure how a word is spelled. Regarding the word 'worshiper' or 'worshipper' in the online entry there, worshipper is also adduced as AE. But I wanted to write it in BE anyway. For the future I'll remember the internal standards.--PLRDLF 07:44, 16 June 2008 (EDT)

Patch help

Hi Rpeh do you think you could help me with something. Basically I'm trying to install the downloadable content from the Knights of the Nine disk. The disk says to first install the patch but when I try it says "old file not found however a file of the same name was located. Update not done as contents do not match". I dont suppose you know the soloution to this problem. 92.23.6.2 05:12, 17 June 2008 (EDT)

I got KotN as a download rather than on disk so I may be wrong about this, but I don't think you have a problem. It sounds like the installer is trying to update your Oblivion files and found it didn't need to because you've already patched it. All you need for KotN to run is the Knights.esp (I think) file in the Data directory and to make sure it's checked in the Data Files list off the launcher screen. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 06:33, 17 June 2008 (EDT)

Email

Hi, just remembered about this. I did receive your other email, but it had hit my spam filter. - Game Lord^{Talk|Contribs} 16:02, 17 June 2008 (EDT)

Good faith?

Regarding this edit, i notice the editor was given an advice notice, if you ask me this appears to be nothing more than the latest reincartation of Dagoth Ur (judging by the edit summmary anyway), what do you think? --Volanaro 13:20, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

Probably. But the IP resolved to America rather than Australia, and isn't a known proxy. That means I can't be sure beyond reasonable doubt. I'm not going to start blocking people indiscriminately because I only suspect people of being DUMG. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 13:23, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

How exactly do you identify the physical loctaion of an i.p.? I could never understand it, anyway, thanks for clearing that up, by the way i only just noticed what DUMG stood for, at first I just thought it was another way of calling vandals DUMB! --Volanaro 13:29, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

There are various sites around the net that will locate an IP, but there's a nice easy way. Go to that IP's talk page and you'll see a row of links along bottom. Click "IP Info" and you'll get a best guess of where the IP is located. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 13:34, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

Thanks for that! Seems like theres a website for everything these days! --Volanaro 13:39, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

WOAH that's freaky. It's accurate down to the STREET?! That's an invasion of privacy if you ask me. List the country and city, yeah. But this is just TOO pinpoint... --HMSVictory^Talk 13:46, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

That's the ISP's address, Victory. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 13:59, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

No, I'm talking about the map. *Shudder* --HMSVictory^Talk 14:01, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

ISP=Internet Service Provider, the map shows the company, not the private address of the subscriber. --Benould^•T•C 14:16, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

Yeah, it's not really accurate at all. I looked up my own IP once, and it was off by two whole states. I wouldn't worry too much about people tracking you down to your house via these tools. --TheRealLurlock ^Talk 14:50, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

Yeah, same here, I tried it and it showed up as hampshire when i live in kent! ISP's are probably only likely to disclose your IP to the police if they see your IP doing anything illegal. --Volanaro 06:59, 20 June 2008 (EDT)

By thew way, I notice that nephele has now blocked that IP, stating that wikipedia has recognised it as an open proxy after all! Looks like those sites arent 100% reliable. (but then again, what is?) --Volanaro 07:05, 20 June 2008 (EDT)

Name Changing

Hi Rpeh. First of all I would like to apologize for using the save changes button too often. I had no idea that it had to be checked every time it saved as this is the first time I've ever actually edited anything. Second of all I would just like to ask if it is possible to change your username. i have accidentally misspelled "Sithis" and was wondering if i could change it. if not then thanks anyway.--The Wrath Of SIthis 16:33, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

No problem - we all have to start learning at some point! The only person that can change your username is Daveh, so you should ask on his talk page. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 16:40, 19 June 2008 (EDT)

Or, you could just create a new account and spell it properly this time. The only real reason to go through a name change process is to make it so that all of your edits are shown under the same account, but since you're new and don't have many edits, there wouldn't be much loss if your edits under the misspelled name didn't get listed under the new name. Oh, and certain user-rights get transferred over when you change names, but again, not relevant since you're new and haven't gotten any special user-rights. --TheRealLurlock ^Talk 21:01, 20 June 2008 (EDT)

Face Help

Hi Rpeh thank you for your advice about the patch everything works fine. But I have another problem by characters appearance keeps changeing. I made a character who I was really happy with and spent a lot of time making his face perfect. I saved the game in the prison and left to do something else, I came back loaded the game up to find his face had completely changed. I'm really angry about it happens every time I load the game up and I've no way of getting him back the way he was. I dont suppose you know what has caused this and how it be fixed?

I've only heard of that happening with vampirism. I don't suppose you changed into a vampire and that's what has caused it? –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 15:04, 20 June 2008 (EDT)

I did have a previous character who was a vampire where I also encountered the problem. But this time it was a brand new character that I had just made. Do you know what causes it to happen to vampires and how it can be fixed.

It's not certain. The best we ever had was this, which was almost totally unhelpful. So I'm afraid I don't have an answer for you. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 17:49, 20 June 2008 (EDT)

Help, Shivering Isles Help..

Hi! i need help with Shivering Isles,Im sheogorath and I cant pay off the fine of 8000 and something,I can only go with gaurds or fight and when i go with gaurds,My bounty stays on.Can u help me? --Prince of Madness 02:20, 21 June 2008 (EDT)

Unfortunately this is a known problem and the only known solution involves using the console so if you're not on the PC there's nothing you can do but load a save from before you got your bounty. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 03:46, 21 June 2008 (EDT)

Yeah... i kinda saved after my bounty.. and im on Xbox 360. Thx for ur help! --Prince of Madness 21:14, 21 June 2008 (EDT)

Awards

Are anyone allowed to give away like cookies or battles or stuff like that? And if anyone can, for what reasons are we allowed to give them away? - Goblin lair 9:41, 22 June 2008 (EDT)

Anybody can give away anything for any reason! I'd suggest not just handing them out for the sake of it, but it's up to you. There's a full list here. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 03:53, 22 June 2008 (EDT)

Birthsign

Hi Rpeh. I know this seems like a silly question but i really wanted your opinion. I've just started a new game with a Dark Elf and I'm planning to make him a Nightblade. My question would be what is a good bithsign to have with a Dark Elf Nightblade.

I honestly don't know. There's no right and wrong about choosing a birthsign. I tend to experiment when making new characters and I've never spent the time trying to work out what's best for each combination. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 09:56, 22 June 2008 (EDT)

Quest, Translation

(moved to cookie jar)

Crimson Scars

Good point about Silarian. Although remeber the Dark Brotherhood did track Grewyn to the Hollow so Silarian could have led them their. Also although you were right to remove the statement about the Minion being the last scar can, I point out that Grewyn despite the note was not the last of them Rowley Eardwulf was, as he was alive after Grewyn's death. Could something about that be added to Rowley's article? - 92.17.228.24 10:33, 23 June 2008 (EDT)

Oh yes. A contradiction! Yes, it looks like Rowley is that last of the scars. If you want to add a note to Rowley's article, feel free. However, I don't believe that the DB did track Greywyn to Deepscorn Hollow. His journal says that he fled there after the massacre of the other scars and he was only handing it over to you because he was about to die. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 10:44, 23 June 2008 (EDT)

When all his preparations were complete, Greywyn approached the Shrine of Sithis for one last prayer. As he intoned the first verse of his dark prayer, he felt a piercing pain explode across his back. The Dark Brotherhood had finally tracked him down. - 92.17.228.24 10:55, 23 June 2008 (EDT)

Yeeees... but "I will be departing this world soon as the cold embrace of the Night Lord calls to me." Your quote is only from the stuff on the download page, it's not actually in-game. Still. You could be right. I dunno. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 12:24, 23 June 2008 (EDT)

Please give more explanation

Shivering:Easter Eggs?; 05:04 . . (-774) . . Rpeh (Talk | contribs) (Undo revision 312284 by 169.145.3.12 (Talk); Sorry but we can't host those kind of comments)

Just wondering why this was deleted. There was nothing obscene written. And I think I provided plenty of proof for my entry in this article unlike many of the specious postings there.169.145.3.12 12:05, 23 June 2008 (EDT)

I'm well aware of the nonsense on the Easter Eggs page but your addition, though well-explained, contained several references to legal material that's not appropriate on a site like this. I'm aware OJ was found guilty at a civil trial but he was nevertheless found innocent in his criminal trial. I'd rather err on the side of caution when making comments about somebody's guilt or innocence. You may think I'm being over-cautious here, but I'd rather be wrong that way than the alternative. Feel free to ask the other admins for their opinions. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 12:19, 23 June 2008 (EDT)

Some of the information seems very tenuous, especially given that the spellings of the names do not match. In the absence of solid substantiation (i.e., a statement from a developer), it's not much more than speculation. And it's speculation that verges on slander. Our site is here to document how to play the games, so unlike Wikipedia we have no reason to venture into documenting controversial real-life situations (and therefore no reason to have Wikipedia's legal staff and legal volunteers). The upshot is that providing biased coverage of events concerning a living person seems unnecessary, especially when the connection to the Elder Scrolls games is speculative. Even if other contributions on the Easter Eggs page need cleanup, at least there's no risk of legal repercussions from the other un-edited entries. --Nephele^Talk 13:15, 23 June 2008 (EDT)

Nephele, if the character's name was "Jim" as opposed to OJ's middle name "James", I think you might have an argument that the information in the posting was tenuous. But it is fair to assume that the developers were trying to drive a point home when they called the "retired assassin" character "Orinthal" (instead of "Orenthal"). Certainly, Bethesda could not spell the name accurately for fear of legal reprisal. However, this site has no such worries. The General Disclaimer at the bottom of every page absolves you of any legal repercussions of someone making a post in speculation of this connection. I think your site is here for entertainment. "Speculation", especially on Easter Egg pages, is part of the entertainment. If your site is here to document how to play the games, why do you have Easter Egg pages? I would be glad to clean up the posting so it does not sound so biased towards an implication of guilt, however, I think it is not in the spirit of the Wiki community to delete the posting outright.169.145.3.13 18:15, 23 June 2008 (EDT)

I'm not particularly in favour of having legally questionable content on the site; why put the site in a situation where we might have to trust in a disclaimer (which was not written by a lawyer, and which focusses upon game-related implications not real-life accusations)? Especially when the content in question is of questionable value, not just questionable legality. However, ultimately legal responsibility for the site falls on the site's owner, Daveh. If you feel that this item is that important, you are free to contact him and see whether you can convince him that the site's need for this information is important enough for him to risk any resulting legal implications. Or if there are other site editors (in particular ones with legal background) who want to contribute their legal knowledge to the discussion, their input would also be welcome.

But short of that I think we're left with two different interpretations of the situation's legality and of the content's relevance. You asked why the content was deleted, and we answered; my opinion, at least, hasn't changed since then. --Nephele^Talk 19:13, 23 June 2008 (EDT)

KotN faction page

After our small discussion here, i found some time to scrath up some info and made a prototype page in my sandbox. Will you please take a look at it and give some feedback? (Unless there already is a page somewhere?) I know it isn't ready to become a full page yet, but it's a start.--LordDagon 12:02, 27 June 2008 (EDT)

It's a good start ("where" should be "were" in the first line) and you could put what you have live, but it's going to need quite a bit of expansion. In particular, adding references (like on Lore:Morag Tong) would help people look up more details on dates and places. Well done for getting things going though! –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 03:33, 28 June 2008 (EDT)

I've knocked up the new page at Lore:Knights of the Nine so other user can edit and add information ( since it isn't custom to edit sandboxes that aren't yours). I've added most i could find. The 'were' mistake has been adjusted.

Whos up for a haircut..

Hey Rpeh why do some khajiti's have Special Hair styles that you can't choose? --Prince of Madness 18:37, 28 June 2008 (EDT)

While this should belong on the Oblivion talk:Khajiit page, I may as well answer it since its here. Most likely, the developers wanted ways to add diversity to the game, if there are hairstyles you can't access it make some characters look special, instead of you saying "oh hey he's got normal hair..." you say, "hmm... there's something unique about them" this also applies to other races, such as the Ancestor Moth Blindfold for Imperials. If you want to see them, you can go into the CS, or download a mod to allow them.-Puddle ^{Talk•Contribs.} 21:47, 28 June 2008 (EDT)

I'd guess that's right. Which Khajiit do you mean though? –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 02:45, 29 June 2008 (EDT)

I think J'Ghasta's an example. He has a hairstyle called "Wisps" which isnt available to the player. A few others have pierced ears as well. There is a mod on TES Nexus called Cassies Complete Hair and Eyes which makes all locked hairstyles available to the player. The best thing about that mod is the fact that the textures and models for the hair already exist in game, so you can unistall the mod after you've chosen your hairstyle and it wont effect the game.

J'skar is like unique because he is technally bald --Prince of Madness 00:25, 2 July 2008 (EDT)

Yeah but he has Pierced ears. According to the CS his hairstyle is "Earrings". - 92.21.172.144 04:57, 2 July 2008 (EDT)

Okay, can we stop this discussion now? It's not really very interesting to be honest and certainly doesn't belong on my talk page. –Rpeh^{•T•C•E•} 05:12, 2 July 2008 (EDT)