Tes5Mod talk:Developer Mods

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Lokir's Tomb[edit]

Bringing this up on the talk page. The Lokir's Tomb mod was removed on the grounds that the mod is a user-created plug-in file. The file was uploaded by user Henning, who claims to be a ZeniMax employee and who also created the companion images. The article which the mod is posted on, Bethesda Tutorial Dungeon Wrapup, was written by Skyrim developer Joel Burgess. The article was obviously a joint effort by ZeniMax/Bethesda, with the tutorial based around that specific file, not just a general description of how to create cells. Unless I'm missing something, it is astoundingly obvious that this file is an "official release", and it would hardly be the most controversial mod to be listed on this page. —Legoless (talk) 19:14, 9 February 2013 (GMT)

Even if it was made by an employee, it is not distributed as a finished article. It is simply a tool for people to skip the very basic part of the Creation Kit tutorial. It is neither stated or implied to be an official release, nor has it been available through Steam. The tutorial is not devised by the same person. There is no file to start the tutorial from either, the whole thing starts by selecting a cell to work on, naming it whatever you want and working from there. The guide uses the placeholder name Lokir's Tomb as simply that, a placeholder, in order to have something to relate to during the guide. Silence is GoldenBreak the Silence 19:23, 9 February 2013 (GMT)
"Real Carriages" is no longer distributed and was not intended for use - seems like a precedent to me. "Lokir's Tomb" is a curiosity, and fits perfectly along with the other three mods listed. If you look at the article's history, you'll notice that it was written with the mod already incorporated into it; regardless, the file's actual relevance to the tutorial has little to do with its status as a "developer mod". I would have to disagree on the lack of implication that it's "official", seeing as its a part of an official Bethesda tutorial. Also, notice that the version of the file linked to is a "finished article" - it's the completed version of the example mod. You seem to be confusing the written tutorial with the actual file; I can't see how else this mod's official status could be brought into question. —Legoless (talk) 19:36, 9 February 2013 (GMT)
I believe the issue is that the mod was not uploaded by the creator of the article, and there is no proof that the person who uploaded it did so with the author's permission or knowledge, and therefore we have no way of proving that it is, in fact, and official mod. It very well could be that someone followed the mod to the letter and then uploaded it to the article. Jeancey (talk) 19:42, 9 February 2013 (GMT)
Here. Direct proof that the author made use of the mod when writing the article. —Legoless (talk) 19:47, 9 February 2013 (GMT)
I agree that the author made use of *A* mod when creating the tutorial, but I don't see any proof that he made use of THAT mod. Someone could have just come along and followed the tutorial, naming everything as it was shown and placing everything in about the same places and uploaded that. The proof that is needed is that the person who uploaded the actual mod file was, in fact, in direct contact with the author and was a Bethesda employee uploaded an official mod. From what I can tell, the mod that got uploaded was about as official and if I followed the tutorial and uploaded that. There is no evidence to the contrary. Why have a tutorial, and then upload the finished product? That's like saying, I'm going to teach you how to bake a cake, so use my handy guide, with cake included. Read the guide, then don't follow it and just eat the cake. It just doesn't make sense. Jeancey (talk) 19:55, 9 February 2013 (GMT)
Did you follow my link? It's the very first version of the article, and the mod is already linked to and the images embedded. User Henning and Joel Burgess were clearly in contact - one made the files, the other wrote the tutorial. —Legoless (talk) 20:00, 9 February 2013 (GMT)

() (edit conflict) The best interpretation of the status of the download would be a test cell. It was created simply for skipping a section of the tutorial. It is also on a par with the images we use to display the three houses available through Hearthfire, examples of what could be, but not as definitive finalized versions. Real Carriages was available on Steam for an approximate half a year, which is rather too long in my eyes to take as "not intended for use". So yes it was created by a Bethesda Employee, and yes it is used on an official wiki, but no, it is not a mod, it is an example, which has to use the only method of implementation available (download), in the only format usable (.esp). We should not go by what people call it as that is always biased, but by what it is, and it is in no way a mod. It is not "the" completed version, it is "a" completed version of the tutorial, the difference in which is substantial, and the same wording on the article. Silence is GoldenBreak the Silence 20:04, 9 February 2013 (GMT)

It's an officially created example, and I'm going to be creating an article for it in modspace anyway. It would be nice to include it on this list, rather than exclude it over technicalities. Distribution is rather irrelevant; Oblivion's official DLC were very hard to get for a few years, and Morrowind's little freebies still aren't available on Steam. Its intended use is also completely unrelated; for comparison, Real Carriages was just an experiment. A fully-functioning radiant dungeon offered for download on an official Bethesda site resembles a mod much more than a silly collection of loading screens on Steam. —Legoless (talk) 20:15, 9 February 2013 (GMT)
I've created an article for the mod. —Legoless (talk) 23:43, 10 February 2013 (GMT)
The filename features the word "complete" in it, so I'm not sure where this notion of it not being complete came from. --87.114.83.65 13:27, 10 February 2015 (GMT)

Deprecation[edit]

As we know, the Real Carriages dev mod now shows a banner on its page stating incompatibility. The Less Werewolf Plz dev mod no longer has a Workshop page. 77.163.197.232 12:19, 26 October 2013 (GMT)