Skyrim talk:Blades/Archive 1

This is an archive of past Skyrim talk:Blades discussions. Do not edit the contents of this page, except for maintenance such as updating links.

Thalmor

Should it talk about the Thalmor hunting them, I think for worshipping talos, in the article?--Br3admax 04:42, 28 November 2011 (UTC)

The Thalmor are hunting them because the leaders of the Blades thought the Thalmor would be a threat to the world and to the next Dragonborn (should one appear), so the Blades went up against them directly, and in a very large way. Religious issues have nothing to do with it, at least from everything Delphine has said thus far. --Thiafy 20:17, 4 December 2011 (UTC)

"The Blades in the Beginning"

This section is inaccurate, as the Blades began as the Akaviri Dragonguard. This is why they use Akaviri weapons and fortresses. I believe this section should be rewritten by someone knowledgeable on Blades lore. CMH 19:06, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

From Reman Cyrodil right?--Br3admax 03:47, 2 December 2011 (UTC)

From 'The Book of the Dragonborn' (found in the basement of Delphine's Inn)

"We know that the Blades, usually thought of as the Emperor's bodyguards originated in Akaviri crusaders who invaded Tamriel for obscure reasons in the late First Era. They appear to have been searching for a Dragonborn - the events at Pale Pass bear this out - and the Akaviri were the first to proclaim Reman Cyrodiil as Dragonborn."

"...Indeed, it is well known that the Akaviri sought out and killed many dragons during their invasion, and there is some evidence that this continued after they became Reman Cyrodiil's Dragonguard (again, the connection to dragons) - the direct predecessor to the Blades of today." Literat 13:33, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

From the book: 'The Rise and Fall of the Blades' (found in the basement of Delphine's Inn):

"Dragons have long been legend in Akavir, and many believe that their brief appearance in Tamriel's history are those that escaped Akaviri, for it was there they were hunted and killed off by the Dragonguard. The Dragonguard would follow those that fled to Tamriel in the late 1st Era."

"Invading from the north, the Dragonguard met not only dragons, but the men of Skyrim, who didn't meet invasions with pitchers of mead. The Dragonguard cut a path through Skyrim, and it was not until they were stopped by Reman Cyrodiil during the battle of Pale Pass that the invasion came to an end. It was Reman who united the human lands of Cyrodiil and defeated the Akaviri invaders."

"...the remaining Dragonguard, upon hearing the voice of Reman Cyrodiil knelt and swore their lives to him, their conqueror and savior."

So Penqepi and Br3admax, I think you are right. The Akaviri Dragonguard (are said to have) hunted down dragons in Akavir. The dragons flew to Tamriel, and the Akaviri followed, and invaded Skyrim. The Akaviri were also searching for the Dragonborn. Reman Cyrodiil defeated them, and the surviving Dragonguard declared he was the person they had been looking for and became his bodyguard. This, in my opinion, seems to be the beginning of the Blades, more or less although it is not clear when they acquired that name.Literat 13:58, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

oh right, 'The Rise and Fall of the Blades' continues:

"They protected Reman with their lives, as well as his descendants, as the Reman Dynasty ushered in Tamriel's 2nd era. It was through these years that their reach extended, and their order grew to become the Blades. Their conquest of the dragons complete, they only sought to protect the Dragonborn, and through him, the Empire." Literat 13:59, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Blades slaying dragons along side Tiber Septim

Unless i'm mistaken dragons were long gone by the time of Tiber Septim, possibly this should be referring to Reman Cyrodiil instead?

In game they say they never saw Tiber Septim kill a dragon during dragon rising, next a NPC said there were not any dragons then, so you're right.--Br3admax 16:30, 3 December 2011 (UTC)

Where is this said in the game, please? Do you mean Oblivion or Skyrim? Literat 13:32, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Skyrim. One of the Whiterun guards says it after you absorb the dragon soul during the quest Dragon Rising. Kitkat ^{•Talk•Contrib•E-mail} 14:03, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Thank you.

Arnold Swartzeneggar: "That's right! My grandfather used to tell stories about the Dragonborn. Those born with the Dragon Blood in 'em. Like old Tiber Septim himself."

Other guard: "I never heard of Tiber Septim killing any dragons."

Arnold Swartzeneggar: "There weren't any dragons then, idiot. They're just coming back now for the first time in... forever. But the old tales tell of the Dragonborn who could kill dragons and steal their power. You must be one!"

So looking at the time line described at: http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:First_Era

1st era 28th century - Reman Cyrodiil (aka Reman I ) defeats the Akaviri and unites Tamriel

1st era 2762 Reman I passes away

1st era 2920 The last year of the 1st era - Reman III is assassinated (I guess the Blades could be said to have failed on that occasion)

and then nearly a millenia goes by, when, in the 9th century of the 2nd era: Tiber Septim conquers Tamriel and ascends to godhood and changes the weather etc.

And somewhere inbetween the dragons were wiped out by the Blades.Literat 16:09, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Removing Followers from the Blades

Is it possible to use PC console command codes to permanently remove followers from the Blades faction that you had brought to Delphine, thus returning them to their normal locations and equipment? I had tried it with Aela, and she returned to Jorrvaskr, but she still wears the Blades armor.Voraxith 01:18, 19 December 2011 (UTC)

---

How did you do that? Even with the faction code I learnt via help command didn't help. I tried both "removefac [code]" and "addfac [code] -1" methods. Lydia is still a Blades member. I don't want to kill Paarthurnax, and I don't want my Lydia to be a part of them :) Schlingel 17:54, 15 January 2012 (GMT+2)

The Blades weren't the 1st dragonslayers?

Article currently says they are the 1st dragonslayers but I doubt this, although so far I am finding it hard to locate something that conclusively nails it.

One difficulty is establishing exactly when the Blades were formed - I'm assuming the 2nd era - around the time of Tiber Septim (edit: no I'm wrong it was roughly 900-1100 years before Tiber Septim)

My feeling is that Alduin was banished by the Elder Scroll before this. At the time he was banished, many dragons were slain (the female warrior Gormlaith Golden-Hilt claimed to have killed 4 that very day). So a question is: when was Alduin banished? Literat 21:46, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Paarthurnax seems to claim that Gormlaith and her companions were the first humans to learn the Voice. Meanwhile, Arngeir says Jurgen Windcaller contemplated the "disaster" at Red Mountain and realised that the humans should have used the Voice for the glory of the gods. So if 1) the disaster at Red Mountain is before Reman Cyrodiil and 2) Gormlaith was before Red Mountain, then 3) Gormlaith is before Reman Cyrodiil and the Blades, and therefore the Blades weren't the first dragonslayers. Sorry it's so convoluted - I'll try and find something better. Literat 21:46, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Well I'm completely ignorant about what the "disaster at Red Mountain" was (edit: it's probably The War of the First Council, i.e. when the Dwarves disappeared 1E 700 or perhaps an event 300 years earlier, either way it seems to be well before the Blades), but I did find a book called 'The Dragon War', which, apparently,

refers to the battle between dragons and men, which led the 3 heroes and Alduin to fight at the Throat of the World:

"When the populace rebelled, the dragon priests retaliated. When the dragon priests could not collect the tribute or control the masses, the dragons' response was swift and brutal. So it was the Dragon War began. At first, men died by the thousands. The ancient texts reveal that a few dragons took the side of men. Why they did this is not known. The priests of the Nine Divines claim it was Akatosh himself that intervened. From these dragons men learned magics to use against dragons. The tide began to turn and dragons began to die too. The war was long and bloody. The dragon priests were overthrown and dragons were slaughtered in large numbers. The surviving dragons scattered, choosing to live in remote places away from men."

And at the beginning of this book it talks about the Merethic Era, (which is before the 1st era):

"In the Merethic Era, when Ysgramor first set foot on Tamriel, his people brought with them a faith that worshipped animal gods...Foremost among them were the dragons."

However, that doesn't necessarily mean the Dragon War took place in the Merethic era. Non-the-less, given that the Blades predecessors, the Akaviri Dragonguard, didn't appear in Tamriel until the 28th century of the 1st era, I feel it is safe to assume that men were killing dragons way, way before the Blades were formed. Literat 15:21, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

When Esbern examines Alduin's Wall: "Look, here is Alduin! This panel goes back to the beginning of Time, when Alduin and the Dragon Cult ruled over Skyrim. ... Here, the humans rebel against their dragon overlords - the legendary Dragon War. ... Alduin's defeat is the centrepiece of the Wall." which suggests the rebellion was a very long time ago but it's not conclusive, (especially since Esbern says the other end of Alduin's Wall depicts the end of time).

Perhaps more conclusive is how, when the player then goes to speak to Paarthurnax to learn Dragonrend, Paarthurnax says he has been waiting for Alduin's return for "thousands of years". Literat 15:07, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

What did the Thalmor message (right before the Great War began) say:

Yes this page is wrong on a few accounts, gramaticly being one of the biggest. From what I heard ingame was not that the Thalmor had a messanger deliver 100 heads of the blades but the messanger delivered an ultimatum demanding the heads of every blades member, this led to war between the emoire and the dominion. Can anyone confirm or deny this? --Zar Pof 09:35, 12 December 2011 (UTC)

Esbern says that the ultimatum demanded the death of every Blade agent operating inside Thalmor territory/organisations:

Dragonborn: "What happened on the 30th of Frostfall?"

Esbern: "It was a cold day. The end of Frostfall is nearly winter in the Jeralll Mountains. We heard the news at Cloud Ruler by courier, riding hard from the Imperial City. 30th of Frostfall, 171. Thirty years ago. The Great War started that day. The Thalmor ambassador delivered his ultimatum to the Emperor Titus Mede: the heads of every Blades agent within the Aldmeri Dominion. I knew, that day, that it was truly the beginning of the end."

(btw I took the liberty of creating a new section to deal with your question since it seemed to be quite a good one) Literat 21:05, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

However, we cannot rule out that the ultimatum was delivered with a hundred heads of Blade members - (after all, it would be the Thalmor style, in my opinion), and there is a source of information that we are yet not taking into consideration:

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Fourth_Era_Major#4E_175 says:

"Titus negotiates with the Thalmor and signs the White-Gold Concordat, a treaty that gives the Thalmor free rein to stamp out the worship of Talos in Tamriel, disbands the Blades, and cedes a large part of southern Hammerfell to the Aldmeri Dominion. Critics note that the terms of the Concordat are almost identical to those of the original ultimatum presented by the Thalmor prior to the war."

Did the writer just make this up about the original ultimatum? i would think it more likely that there's some more information on the ultimatum out there somewhere - maybe a book in the Skyrim game?

On the other hand, why didn't Esbern say to the Dragonborn "the ultimatum was delivered with 100 Blades heads"? Literat 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Read http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:The_Great_War It says "On the 30th of Frostfall, 4E 171, the Aldmeri Dominion sent an ambassador to the Imperial City with a gift in a covered cart and an ultimatum for the new Emperor. The long list of demands included staggering tributes, disbandment of the Blades, outlawing the worship of Talos, and ceding large sections of Hammerfell to the Dominion. Despite the warnings of his generals of the Empire's military weakness, Emperor Titus Mede II rejected the ultimatum. The Thalmor ambassador upended the cart, spilling over a hundred heads on the floor: every Blades agent in Summerset and Valenwood. And so began the Great War which would consume the Empire and the Aldmeri Dominion for the next five years."74.215.200.49 07:49, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Add it to the article, too much non-skyrim on the page right now.--Br3admax 07:51, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

That's really good - a quote from an actual virtual book in the Skyrim game, thank you. (Summerset Isle + Valenwood = Aldmeri Dominion.) However it does seem to conflict with Esbern's account (he says that they only demanded the heads of the Blades agents?), to the point that I must now consider whether I have made an error and quoted Esbern incorrectly. I'll just find the save game and check exactly what he says. Literat 14:29, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Ok I quoted Esbern accurately (with one slight error) but I interpreted him incorrectly:

"....Thirty years ago. The Great War started that day. The Thalmor ambassador delivered his ultimatum to the Emperor Titus Mede: the heads of every Blades agent within the Aldmeri Dominion. I knew, that day, that it was truly the beginning of the end."

It's a bit strange that he says the ultimatum is the cart of heads, itself, but it's difficult to argue against the virtual book: The Great War. I conclude: there were heads. Literat 14:57, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

The Blades wiped the dragons out

There are reasons for thinking the Blades wiped the dragons out in Tamriel (and surely the article on the Blades should mention this):

After reading the Elder Scroll at the Time-Wound, if you speak with Paarthurnax:

Dragonborn: "Dragonreach was built to hold a dragon?" Paarthurnax: "Yes. This was ages ago, you understand. There were more of us then. Before the brunikke - the akaviri - came and killed all my zeymoh."

(presumably 'zeymoh' = brothers)

Arngeir seems to agree with this more or less, for, if you go to speak with him instead: Arngeir: "Do you know Dragonsreach? The Jarl of Whiterun's palace? It's name is no accident. The palace was originally built to hold a captive dragon." Dragonborn: "But I thought there weren't any dragons until Alduin came back." Arngeir: "Oh, this was back in the days of Olaf_One-Eye, thousands of years ago. In those days, dragons could still be found among the remote mountain peaks. Before the blades wiped them all out." Literat 13:30, 20 December 2011 (UTC)

Also the book 'The Rise and Fall of the Blades' backs this up. However, it says the dragon cull began with the Akaviri Dragonguard (possibly before they came to Tamriel), and before they found the Dragonborn Reman Cyrodiil, swore to protect him and thereby formed (the organization that became) the Blades.

Do the Blades serve the Emperor?

The article currently says they do. However, I feel it is more accurate to say they serve the Emperor/Empress, but only if he/she is the Dragonborn. After Martin Septim turned into a big statue in the Oblivion game, there weren't any Dragonborn left, and I think the Blades at that point didn't have much to do with the Emperor. Instead the role of bodyguard was assumed by the Penitus Oculatus. This is why Delphine says something like "for 200 years the Blades had been searching for a purpose" (maybe). Literat 20 December 2011 (UTC)

However, it may be that Penitus Oculatus are the bodyguard simply because the Blades were officially dissolved at the end of the Great War, and that the Blades never gave up their duties as servants of the Emperor? Literat 15:32, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

The book 'Anals of the Dragonguard' is a diary which describes how, shortly after the time of Reman Cyrodiil, the Akaviri Dragonguard at Sky Haven Temple completely ignored direct orders from Emperor Kastav, probably on humanitarian grounds i.e. Kastav was a moron. Literat

Redo

This page has become to much of a lore page, I think it should be like the faction page for the blades in oblivion, with most of this page(anything before 4E 01) moved to the lore page, while this page discusses the benefits and the faction in skyrim only, it's not lore:blades, it's skyrim:blades. Should they page be redone.--Br3admax 06:58, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

I see what you are saying: at the moment about half the page on Skyrim:Blades is dedicated to lore before/during the Oblivion crisis. The Oblivion:Blades page has a bit of history but it's mainly about what the Blades are like as you encounter them in the game (and there is a link to the lore page "for more general information")

Delphine and Esbern i.e. the Blades (that's all that's left) seem to be very loyal to *some* of the Blades lore: the Avakiri Dragonguard relentlessly hunting down dragons, the Blades completing the cull/genocide (if I may use so strong a term)

but they ignore the lore about being the bodyguard for the emperor "the Blades are the Eyes and Ears of the Emperor" (presumably this is because the Emperor is no longer Dragonborn).

and, in my opinion, they don't really pay much reverence to the Dragonborn either ("kill Parthanax or we won't help you"). In contrast, the lore says the Akaviri Dragonguard reverred the Dragonborn, (as Esbern says at the entrance to Sky Haven temple in the game). But I guess the Parthanax stance is more of a game mechanic - social/moral dilemma for the player sort of thing - and really the Blades exist for the Dragonborn.

So I suppose the lore should perhaps mainly be about explaining the mentality of the Blades as they are encountered in Skyrim. They use to be great dragonslayers, they are here to protect the Dragonborn, and they have a big enmity with the Thalmor. And the rest (main bit) of the page should be like the Oblivion:Blades page? Then it is practical - for the gameplayer (the majority). "This happens in the game and then you can do this and do that" sort of thing. Literat 17:04, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Exactly, if you look at the pages it'n not even the same lore, no daggerfall at all. It's all based on the end of oblivion, the blades were not really looking for attacks on the emperor only.--Br3admax 15:06, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Yeah good point - there's Blades lore on a golem called Numidium that seems to be related to Daggerfall, but it doesn't make the article at the moment, so why should Oblivion stuff about e.g. serving the Elder Council - which also seems a bit dated?

Also, if you look at the Skyrim:Dark Brotherhood page they have virtually no lore whatsoever. It's all about playing the game, what happens, what you can do etc. Which is great. Very practical and helpful.

However I wonder perhaps that isn't a bit too much like a wiki stub i.e. not enough information because with the Dark Brotherhood, even without a Listener, there is a strong influence from the Daedra: the Night Mother slaughtered her own children. Isn't that lore really quite relevant to the character of the organization? They are brutal killers, after all.

Also, I talked about the importance of accuracy before but reading http://www.uesp.net/wiki/UESPWiki:Getting_Started it says perfection isn't required: "If you have something to contribute, you should add it. Don't worry too much about making mistakes. Mistakes on the wiki are pretty easy to fix, and we would rather have editors who contribute plenty of information and make a few mistakes than have editors who never add their information because they are too worried about not being able to do it perfectly."

So with that in mind, I feel we should make changes:

• Firstly, I'm going to cut out the claim of Blades as 1st dragonslayers because that's probably false, due to the Dragon War taking place "thousands of years" ago.
• The page currently says: "...first fighting dragons at the side of Reman Cyrodiil because he was Dragonborn." but that's probably wrong since The Rise and Fall of the Blades has the Akaviri Dragonguard killing dragons in Akavir before they met Reman.
• "Their main base of operations was Cloud Ruler Temple in Cyrodiil." doesn't really matter that much, it isn't in Skyrim and I think it was sacked by the Thalmor? Literat 17:04, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
• Battle of Sancre Tor involved Tiber Septim routing some invaders, I'm guessing it's not "the most notable battle for the Blades" any more. It may well an important part of Blade history but I feel it doesn't meet the criteria we're talking about of "is it relevant to Skyrim the game"
• However, I like what the article says about the Blades playing a role in resolving the Oblivion Crisis, because it was a major event, more recent, I played Oblivion and liked it, many other people did too, I guess you could argue the same about Daggerfall and Morrowind though. Literat 17:05, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
• I don't know what to make of the Remanada with it's flowery, somewhat ambiguous language. The Blades were lead by a pig? Some of them were vampires? Some guy made love to a hillock? A big question I now have is: what's a hillock and how would one make love to it? I'm just struggling with it. Cuhlecain seems to be the Emperor before Tiber Septim? I feel all this should go for now, unless someone wants to make a case for it's inclusion. Certainly, it should be somewhere in the Blades Lore but not, in my opinion, in the Skyrim:Blades page. Literat 17:48, 21 December 2011 (UTC)
• The first paragraph: I want to get any talk of specific Blades members out of there because it started off as an introductory paragraph but then it had the bit about adding new members bolted on to the end. Which is important information but it needs to be moved past the lore (i.m.o.).

Okay I've rewritten loads. I am really sorry if I've ripped up anyone's hard work. What's needed now, I suppose, is a big addition of what happens with the Blades in the game.

Literat 18:52, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

The "emperor" before Talos was not really emperor, he was killed, also Talos was dragonborn. Talos said he recieved a dream to retrieve the amulet of kings to become the true empeoror to hold the gates of oblivion closed.--Br3admax 20:54, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

The massacres at the Blades strongholds.

Please can anyone explain: When did these massacres occur? I guess they occurred during the Great War and not after? Where does it say they occurred? Literat 19:43, 21 December 2011 (UTC)

Should Bleak Falls Burrow be included in the 'Related quests' list?

Bleak Falls Barrow: Retrieve the Dragonstone. Although this quest is initiated by Whiterun's court wizard Farengar, at the end of the quest Delphine appears in the palace at Whiterun and takes the Dragonstone back to her inn. I guess she orchestrated the whole thing. There are no Blades in the actual quest, just the end. The Dragonstone is then used by the Blades. Literat 05:32, 22 December 2011 (UTC)

You bring up a good point, but I think its a bit of a stretch. In my opinion, I don't think that we should include it.--J'ZhirrthePriest 23:39, 3 April 2012 (UTC)

Being blunt, Delphine is involved so it stays. thats the way the cookie crumbles. The Silencer has spoken 00:34, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Its in the title of the section related quests she is in the quest, albeit at the end so she is related to the quest and thus the blades are involved. The Silencer has spoken 02:49, 4 April 2012 (UTC)

Recruiting

Who would some good Blades recruits be? I'm asking because I want to know who can stay alive when they go dragon hunting. Lucien LachanceDB 14:18, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

Any housecarl spawned later in your leveling up.Br3admax 14:28, 7 January 2012 (UTC)

Essential/Inventory/Quests

In the game you have the option of training your follower as blades. If you chose an essential follower (such as one of the circle of companions, after you finish the quest line) would they still be essential? Moreover, could you change their equipment or still get radiant quests from them?

Review

Someone tell me what this article needs, this is my specialty. Note, I can't get any images, but I can do anything else.--Br3admax 03:39, 12 February 2012 (UTC) Any image would also be great.--Br3admax 16:30, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

Needs game-ifying, I would say. Condense "The Rise and Fall of the Blades" into a sentence or two, if that, and expand on the Blades' role in Skyrim, with some mention of what happens in the quests. --Velyanthe 16:40, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

I'm going to make this like the Greybeards page, they are "rival", any objections.Br3admax 16:57, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

Image: I'm level 40, did "related quests" 1 and 2. Will do 3 ... sometime when I can stop myself from editing. As of now, is there somewhere I can go and take a useful screenshot for you? I'm working on re-writing Way of the Voice quest at the moment, so I am hanging out with the Greybeards. I'll do something that doesn't take too much time, otherwise, I guess I can get a good one from "Blade in the Dark" once I'm doing it. --JR^{Talk E-mail} 17:13, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

I just need any follower, with their name, in Blades armor, or the entire team on a dragon hunt. Even get a training session photo, we have nothing.Br3admax 17:40, 12 February 2012 (UTC)

Sorry, I forgot to answer you. I will need to complete some quests before I can see a Blade in Blades armor, I think. It might take me some time. --JR^{Talk E-mail} 06:48, 14 February 2012 (UTC)

Is it ok for tag removal.Br3admax 22:43, 20 February 2012 (UTC)

Replacement

I think this page is pretty lack luster at the moment. As such, for the past few weeks, I have been remaking the page in my sandbox. What do you guys think, is it okay to replace the Blades page here with it, or what do you think I should change about it?--Br3admax (talk) 22:48, 16 September 2012 (GMT)

Most of my critiques about the existing article, not your changes. I don't know if "rivals" is the best way to describe their relationship with the Greybeards. They are heavily critical of the Greybeards, certainly, but the two don't really compete with each other. A lot of the opening is written like a lore article, with the conclusions of the game being stated up front. It seems to me a gamespace article like this should act more like a guide on their role in the game, like how Morrowind:Blades is arranged. While the current Blades lore article is pretty, well, not pretty, a lot of their history which is not strictly relevant for this goal can be summarized there and linked to here. Minor Edits^{Threats•Evidence} 00:31, 17 September 2012 (GMT)

Edit, I've made some changes. If it is the amount of info, i could do some pruning.--Br3admax (talk) 00:44, 17 September 2012 (GMT)

Nah, might as well post it. If someone else thinks it needs pruning, let them worry about it. Minor Edits^{Threats•Evidence} 00:52, 17 September 2012 (GMT)

"Grandmaster" Delphine

When is she referred to as Grandmaster? If anything she and Esbern make decisions together. ALMSIVI (talk) 12:13, 1 October 2012 (GMT)

This dialogue line (0x000e67f1): "Then by my right as acting grandmaster, I name you a Blade, with all the privileges, rights, and burdens that brings. Godspeed." ~ Psylocke 13:26, 1 October 2012 (GMT)

Then she should be refered to as "Acting Grandmaster" instead of "Grandmaster." 144.183.31.2 11:56, 30 July 2013 (GMT)

Blade skills correction

The article says: "All Blade recruits wear the standard Blades equipment. As such, the best Blades are well trained in the heavy armor, archery, one-hand, and block skills."

However, neither Delphine, nor Esbern are really trained in heavy armor. It should be either removed, or rewrittent to point out, that it is better to recruit characters trained in these skills into the Blades (which may be controversial, because someone would think mages will make better in fights against dragons.)Sergio Morozov (talk) 12:02, 31 January 2013 (GMT)

I've rewritten it to (hopefully) remove the opinionated aspects. Feel free to improve it if you like. — ABCface^◥ 16:54, 31 January 2013 (GMT)

I dare not to touch the perfect text you had created! Sergio Morozov (talk) 17:05, 6 February 2013 (GMT)

Oathblade relevance

Hi Br3admax, regarding your edit, this seems a subjective issue. (Meaning, of course, that there's nothing wrong with your perspective as well as the other.) If the blade and its disappearance is relevant to the Blades, however, it is hard to imagine why information about its reappearance would not be. Let's have a discussion on this. I don't know much about the topic, but I don't see anything wrong with keeping the contribution, and I imagine it could be useful or interesting to some users. If I was 50/50 on it, I'd tend to leave the contribution instead of reverting it. Alternative points of view? --JR (talk) 15:20, 19 February 2013 (GMT)

The comment was focused on the info about the cave respawning, which is unrelated to the blades, and doesn't belong here. Nevermind that there was a recent post that the cave doesn't respawn. Silence is Golden^{Break the Silence} 16:31, 19 February 2013 (GMT)

I posted that more as a question to determine whether the Oathblade is SUPPOSED to respawn, and I am just encountering an anomaly. I'm not at all confident that my experience is the norm. Does anyone else have confirmation of the Oathblade reappearing after the area resets, post "Ill Met By Moonlight"? --Scribbles (Crayolamanic) 00:52, 20 February 2013 (GMT)

Yeah, JR, it's not important for the faction, and if it were true it would belong on the cave's page. As to the cave resetting, I think not. It stays that way. Sorry. And if it's a question you would ask on The Cave's talk page.--Br3admax (talk) 02:07, 20 February 2013 (GMT)

I removed the info about the Oathblade disappearing, then noticed this topic. It's not relevant to a page about the Blades, and the quest is now linked in the note, so readers can follow the link and discover this. --Xyzzy ^Talk 06:00, 10 May 2013 (GMT)

Blades Info - moved from article

==Blades Supporters in Skyrim==

• Malborn (not a Blade himself but a Bosmer whose family lost their lives to The Thalmor so he serves The Blades not as a Blade himself but as a spy)

Note - it is unlikely for an alliance but it is possible The Alikr, The Psiijic Order, and other Anti-Thalmor factions have at least neutral relations with The Blades de to their common enemy

==Reccent Blades Members and Possible Members of The Blades found within Skyrim==

• Fultheim (possibly a Blades veteran based on his possession of a Blades' Sword- see bottom of the page)
• Acilius Bolar (A likely killed Blades member who left behind his sword and a note in Bloated Man's Grotto before he went to meet his fate- see bottom of the page)

I'm moving this latest info here for discussion. It doesn't seem relevant to me, and much of it is speculative. --Xyzzy ^Talk 04:49, 23 March 2013 (GMT)

I agree. While Acilius was a Blade, he is long since dead. Malborn is merely an informant and there is nothing on Fultheim aside from his sword. Murbul wears a Storcloak officer helmet and Sharamph wears a Shrouded hood, it doesn't mean they're part of each faction. Yes, Fultheim is old so maybe he's a blade; but I don't think a weapon is enough to declare him as one of them. Elakyn (talk) 16:05, 23 March 2013 (GMT)

This is all rather speculative and doesn't belong here. Malborn might deserve a reference, but Bolar and Fultheim already have a spot on the article (even if it's just under notes). --AKB ^{Talk Cont Mail} 16:15, 23 March 2013 (GMT)

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